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[2a00:1450:400c:c00::235]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v4si449984wiz.2.2015.01.18.00.09.11 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 18 Jan 2015 00:09:11 -0800 (PST) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::235 as permitted sender) client-ip=2a00:1450:400c:c00::235; Received: by mail-wg0-x235.google.com with SMTP id x13so26837127wgg.12 for ; Sun, 18 Jan 2015 00:09:11 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.194.91.145 with SMTP id ce17mr46753961wjb.132.1421568551803; Sun, 18 Jan 2015 00:09:11 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.194.86.200 with HTTP; Sun, 18 Jan 2015 00:08:51 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20150117194920.GD14149@mercury.ccil.org> From: Gleki Arxokuna Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2015 11:08:51 +0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [bpfk] Question on {z} vs. {dz} and {ts} To: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7bfd01508de14d050ce8b85b X-Original-Sender: gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com designates 2a00:1450:400c:c00::235 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: bpfk-list@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list bpfk-list@googlegroups.com; contact bpfk-list+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 972099695765 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.8 X-Spam_score_int: 8 X-Spam_bar: / X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "stodi.digitalkingdom.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: 2015-01-18 11:00 GMT+03:00 Jonathan Jones : > Where? All I see in your post is "should we get rid oz [z]" and "if we get > rid of [z], we'll need to do this stuff too". > I suppose to do that one needs to always insert buffer between {dz}, never pronounce {dz} as an affricate and may be even always insert {y} in {radzu'e}. [...] Content analysis details: (0.8 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 URIBL_BLOCKED ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to URIBL was blocked. See http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block for more information. [URIs: ccil.org] 2.7 DNS_FROM_AHBL_RHSBL RBL: Envelope sender listed in dnsbl.ahbl.org [listed in googlegroups.com.rhsbl.ahbl.org. 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All I see in your post is "should we get rid oz [z]" and "if we get > rid of [z], we'll need to do this stuff too". > I suppose to do that one needs to always insert buffer between {dz}, never pronounce {dz} as an affricate and may be even always insert {y} in {radzu'e}. > > On Sun, Jan 18, 2015 at 12:37 AM, Gleki Arxokuna < > gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Wait, I offered a solution. Why didn't you comment on it? >> >> 2015-01-17 22:49 GMT+03:00 John Cowan : >> >>> Gleki Arxokuna scripsit: >>> >>> > Today I was reminded of one "flaw" in phonology namely, the presense >>> of [z] >>> > in Lojban. >>> >>> If we go down that road there is no end to it. English has no /x/, >>> Arabic has no /b/, Chinese not only lacks /z/ but also /h/ and the >>> sounds written "e" and "o" are more like Lojban "y" and "uy". >>> Spanish has no /y/ nor /c/. Hindi is missing /h/, as is Russian. >>> Finally all that would be left is p~b, t~d, g~k, and a, i, u. >>> >>> -- >>> John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan@ccil.org >>> If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing >>> on my shoulders. --Hal Abelson >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "BPFK" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to bpfk-list+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to bpfk-list@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "BPFK" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to bpfk-list+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to bpfk-list@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > > > -- > mu'o mi'e .aionys. > > .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o > (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "BPFK" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bpfk-list+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bpfk-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "BPFK" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bpfk-list+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bpfk-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/bpfk-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --047d7bfd01508de14d050ce8b85b Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


2015-01-18 11:00 GMT+03:00 Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>:
Where? All I see in your post i= s "should we get rid oz [z]" and "if we get rid of [z], we&#= 39;ll need to do this stuff too".

<quote>
I suppose to do that one needs to always inse= rt buffer between {dz}, never pronounce {dz} as an affricate and may be eve= n always insert {y} in {radzu'e}.=C2=A0

</q= uote>
=C2=A0

On S= un, Jan 18, 2015 at 12:37 AM, Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@g= mail.com> wrote:
Wait,= I offered a solution. Why didn't you comment on it?

2015-01-17 22:49 GMT= +03:00 John Cowan <cowan@mercury.ccil.org>:
Gleki Arxokuna scripsit:

> Today I was reminded of one "flaw" in phonology namely, the = presense of [z]
> in Lojban.

If we go down that road there is no end to it.=C2=A0 English has no = /x/,
Arabic has no /b/, Chinese not only lacks /z/ but also /h/ and the
sounds written "e" and "o" are more like Lojban "y= " and "uy".
Spanish has no /y/ nor /c/.=C2=A0 Hindi is missing /h/, as is Russian.
Finally all that would be left is p~b, t~d, g~k, and a, i, u.

--
John Cowan=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 http://www.ccil.org/~cowan=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 cowan@ccil.o= rg
If I have not seen as far as others, it is because giants were standing
on my shoulders.=C2=A0 --Hal Abelson

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--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do z= o'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )

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For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

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