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Subject: [jvsw] Definition Added At Word vo'a'e'i -- By bairyn
Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2025 00:04:36 +0000
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In jbovlaste, the user bairyn has added a
definition of "vo'a'e'i" in the language "English".

New Data:

	Definition:
		pro-sumti: repeats 1st place of innermost application selbri (even in descriptions).

	Notes:
		{ni'o} Proposed experimental cmavo sequence: {vo'a'e}…{vo'u'e} is a variant of {vo'a}…{vo'u} and is the same except it is explicitly a pro-sumti for the current (innermost) bridi, rather than the outermost bridi, or the innermost application (even within descriptions), or with the bridi choice left vague.

{ni'o} The {vo'a}…{vo'u} sequence's choice of bridi is ambiguous: it depends on which Lojban standard you use.  Under the CLL, it is the current bridi, meaning it is the same as the proposed cmavo sequence: {vo'a'e}…{vo'u'e}.  Under {la} {ma'oste} usage, it is the outermost bridi.  See also the English Lojban wiki's page titled ‘'''vo'a''' in the CLL and in the ma'oste’ for a discussion on this topic.

{ni'o} Proposed secondary axis index semantics: Use e.g. {vo'a'e}{xi}{pi'e}{re} to refer to the second-innermost bridi.  Perhaps {vei}…{ve'o} can be used to nest groups if needed.  (Without {pi'e}, {vo'a'e} as usual if indexed with {xi} would just change what place it refers to, e.g. x6.) (Perhaps then {vo'a'e} would be shorthand for {vo'a}{xi}{pi'e}{ni'u}{pa} or {vo'a}{xi}{pi'e}{ro} under the {la} {ma'oste} language dialect, saving 5 syllables.)

{ni'o} Additional proposed experimental cmavo sequences: {vo'a'e}…{vo'u'e} selects bridi from the innermost (suggested mneumonic: ‘'e’ as in ‘se’ for a reflexive pronomial verb in some languages), {vo'a'ei}…{vo'u'ei} selects bridi from the outermost bridi (suggested mneumonic: ‘'ei’ as in ‘nei’ (like ‘dei’) as an alternative to using {vo'a'ei}…{vo'u'ei} when combined with {lo} and SE), and {vo'a'e'i}…{vo'u'e'i} selects from the innermost applicable selbri, allowing for direct reflexives, even in applications (suggest mneumonic: rafsi of {sevzi}).  Finally, {vo'a'o'e}…{vo'a'o'e} could be defined for the variant of an unspecified bridi, as in {xi}{pi'e}{xo'e}.  Example: in {i} {mi} {krici} {lo}{du'u} {lo} {bende} {cu} {se} {xamgu} {lo} {djuno} {be} {fi} {vo'a}, the {'ei} variant (outermost) would mean that those who know the speaker are good for the team, the {'e} (innermost / current) variant would mean that those who know the team are good for it, and the {'e'i} variant would mean that those who know themselves are beneficial for the team.

	Jargon:
		

	Gloss Keywords:

	Place Keywords:


You can go to <http://jbovlaste.lojban.org/dict/vo'a'e'i> to see it.