Message-ID: <20030802224642.35006.qmail@web41901.mail.yahoo.com>
Date: Sat, 2 Aug 2003 15:46:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jorge "Llambías" <jjllambias2000@yahoo.com.ar>
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: What does la'e mean?
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la iuvál cusku di'e

> > It would be more proper to say {mi tcidu la'o gy. The Long Dark Tea-Time 
> > of the soul gy}.
> >
> Yet The Reference Grammar gives:
> "
> mi viska la'e zoi kuot. A Tale of Two Cities .kuot I see that-represented- 
> by the-text `` A Tale of Two Cities ''. I see the book ``A Tale of Two 
> Cities''
> "
> in chapter 20.

Right! Still, why use {la'e zoi} for that when we have {la'o}.

> >> This usage maintains {da cmene la'e da} for all {da}.
> >
> > {la'e lu le gerku li'u} is the referent of "le gerku",
> > i.e. the dog, it is not something named "the dog".
> >
> Yet The Reference Grammar gives:
> "
> 	10.3)    mi viska la'e lu le xunre cmaxirma li'u
> 	I see the-referent-of
>         [quote] the red small-horse [unquote]		
> "
> and says this means seeing something named "The Red Pony" rather than
> something described as a red pony.

So it does. I guess that means that {la'e} is ambiguous. Another issue
for the bpfk to deal with.

> > Otherwise, how would we say the "that" of {la'e di'u}?
> >
> How about {lesu'u go'i}?

Yes, but {di'u} is not always about {go'i}. In many cases it refers
to a subclause (though this is not in CLL), and it can also refer to 
several bridi (this is in CLL). {la'e di'u} is in CLL too. 
In Chapter 7:

  4.6)  mi prami la djein. .i mi nelci le'e di'u
        I love Jane. And I like the-referent-of the-last-utterance.
        I love Jane, and I like that.

Not "I like something named 'mi prami la djein'". With di'u, the common
use of {la'e di'u} is the useful one. With quotes, the meaning
"the named ..." is probably more useful.

mu'o mi'e xorxes


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