From: der Mouse <mouse@Rodents.Montreal.QC.CA>
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Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:01:12 -0500 (EST)
To: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: "Lupin's left eye is rebelling"
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> In the spirit of the blind leading the blind,

Must be bceause our eyes are rebelling too. :)

>> "Lupin's left eye is rebelling" [...] I ended up with {le la lupin.
>> zunle kanma cu fapro damba mi}.
> Well, if we change kanma for kanla, it looks okay,

Oops, yes, that's what I wanted.  I assume *{kanma} must have come from
a typo somewhere along the line.

> although it has the extra specific that he's rebelling against you
> specifically.

True; that wasn't in the original language but was implicit in the
context (though I suppose there's no reason not to leave it to context
in the lojban as well, in which case I suppsoe omit the {mi}).

> I think it might be a little nicer to say {le la lupin. zunle kanla
> cu damba co fapro mi} making it "fighting (against me)".

When I picked {fapro damba}, I was trying to translate "rebel".
{fapro} and {damba} really seem very similar in meaning but with
slightly different emphasis; I was aiming for something like "struggle
against".

> It seems like there sould be a way to say "the thing satisfying
> predicate P" or "a thing satisfying predicate P"...

I believe this is what {le} does.  What you need, it seems to me, is a
way to attach {la lupin.} to the x2 place of {pixra}.  As I understand
it, that's what {be} does: {le pixra be la lupin.} (possibly plus
{be'o} depending on what follows).

This leads to {le zunle kanla pe le pixra be la lupin. be'o damba co
fapro mi}, where I think the {be'o} can be omitted, but I'm not sure.

> I think we need someone who knows what they're doing. 

That would help, yes, and someone will likely show up soon.  But in the
meantime, we can enjoy bumbling along as we are.... :)

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