Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Sun, 13 Feb 2005 12:45:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from genamics.blastula.net ([205.214.85.184]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_3DES_EDE_CBC_SHA:24) (Exim 4.34) id 1D0H7b-000895-Mz for lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 02:37:00 -0800 Received: from [203.184.4.126] (helo=gulik.co.nz) by genamics.blastula.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.43) id 1D0H7Z-00039c-SA for lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 23:36:58 +1300 Message-ID: <420F2DC7.4050704@gulik.co.nz> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 23:36:55 +1300 From: Michael van der Gulik User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040216 Debian/1.6.x.1-10 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: newb needs urging forward References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed X-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - genamics.blastula.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - chain.digitalkingdom.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - gulik.co.nz X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-archive-position: 1140 X-Approved-By: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-original-sender: mikevdg@gulik.co.nz Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@chain.digitalkingdom.org X-list: lojban-beginners Content-Length: 1447 WGraph wrote: >The point is the motivation behind learning lojban. Basically I have been >changing in a fundamental way, long story short I had one of those life >changing realizations, dropped out of third year engineering. The reason is >really hard to explain (the crux of the problem), and boils down to what it >is to be conscious, how we think, why am I alive, etc. > > Go talk to a priest, vicor, rabbi or whatever. They love this stuff. >I've been writing extensively and I am constantly finding difficutly in >expressing my ideas, like there are no words in existence that can express >them. > >I guess I want to use lojban, not for speaking but expressing very abstract >ideas about consiousness and life. But how do I know I won't experience the >same things, or even worse. As I understand it lojban is made up of >functions and arguments (you can call them sumpti and whatever, but that is >basically what they are). > > I suggest you stop thinking about your ideas and read more first. Metaphysics, philosophy, religion. Lojban is great as a geek toy, but it won't help you understand nay express the big questions about life any more than learning to saw wood would make you an amazing wood-carver. That's not to say that learning Lojban isn't a great pastime! I'm learning it to broaden my horizons, and I hope that one day it will lend me some insight into how to create a sentient artificial intelligence. Mikevdg.