Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:42:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IfvV0-0002tg-Pe for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:42:52 -0700 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.190]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1IfvUV-0002sT-96 for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:42:33 -0700 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id 4so386808nfv for ; Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:41:49 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; bh=B16v02KmcxoBuLEkD0V/A55i9sk0XX7KllAuNTQUU+4=; b=k74qvZF4WDZAt4QrXt4iPaWIPeRdZVrp/epKZoVVYFbMJmZQrCytms9MZ4S3s050mxMQXzw+oajfJhcKDzFGGzuNZ6tXYNMbEGMMnv0t2yX8FyO/IMQDKQnai4W7XI3xOcVIQExYUtCpaxvt2xqNkp70R4EDs4TsSMIZFnfljVM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=fUYlqBucPdEopJQRJXLUJP3NFEI6Yuo4hcPYrXe8hZDjokNJJSdHHdxIuwEpZGxNCXKSdqpjZTwRAwu49TTKgSMJRiadJ2fjyMfJay5tOXTcDmGlCD2I/KWoybwX0OCMy7RDeUrjlylFk+KLJ93o4P1mhRcr2Pr/DSQ6zhUnRr4= Received: by 10.78.204.20 with SMTP id b20mr1276383hug.1192099309203; Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.78.120.20 with HTTP; Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:41:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 11:41:49 +0100 From: "james riley" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: yet more beginner questions In-Reply-To: <71550650710110250g10bc02c3y5892e00cdc6c07de@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_16963_12909211.1192099309193" References: <71550650710110250g10bc02c3y5892e00cdc6c07de@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 5477 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jimr1603@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Content-Length: 6736 ------=_Part_16963_12909211.1192099309193 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hi, relatively new myself so I'll answer to the best of my ability. On 11/10/2007, Yoav Nir wrote: > > Hi. > I'm new to studying lojban, and am working my way through "Lojban for > beginners" > > I have a few questions already. > > First, is how to spell my name. I know the English spelling doesn't give a > lot of clues (it's a Hebrew name). It's pronounced as two syllables, the > first is like "Yo" in yonder, the second "av" as in the first syllable of > "avril" in Spanish. I'm guessing that ioav won't cut it because of the three > consecutive vowels, so should it be io,av. Also am I supposed to capitalize > the second syllable (io,AV) to show where the stress is every time, or is > that optional? > If you want the stress putting in on your name I'd keep the capital AV. Second, I've read that lojban names have to end in a consonant, so if they > don't, we add one. My question is, do we pronounce the 's' in la meiris ? > Technically, names have been updated since lojban for beginners was written. I suggest that you join us on the lojban irc ( http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=Lojban+IRC&bl) where there's always someone who is passionately annoyed that L4B is so out of date. Essentially there are cmene which is anything that is a name. I may point at a dog that I may name in English as "Mr Dog" I may call it {la gerku} in lojban (we often use curly brackets to quote lojban text within natural language text). There {gerku} is acting as a cmene and definitely does not require a final consonant. However, what English uses for "proper nouns" lojban essentially uses "cmevla". This is a cmene that which ends in a consonant. Generally these mean nothing but what they point to as a name. So {cmacis} can have interpretations forced on it, but it means me! As for the final s, if it is written in lojban then it is pronounced. This is a feature! Third, I've seen that the apostrophe is used to make an 'h' sound, whereas > the h character is not used. Why is that? Why didn't the inventors of > lojban (or does it date back to loglan?) simply use an h for the h sound? > Because the ' is a special letter. It is only used to separate vowel pairs. It is given this special symbol so that people don't confuse it with a normal letter. In the past there was a bit of a fashion for using h or H for ', but that has passed and was before my time. That's it for now. I'm sure I'll have more questions as I go on. > > mi'e io,AV > > Please do share them with us. The lojban irc is a nice place to practise and ask questions. mu'o mi'e cmacis ------=_Part_16963_12909211.1192099309193 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Hi, relatively new myself so I'll answer to the best of my ability.

On 11/10/2007, Yoav Nir <yoav.nir@gmail.com > wrote:
Hi.

I'm new to studying lojban, and am working my way through "Lojban for beginners"

I have a few questions already.

First, is how to spell my name. I know the English spelling doesn't give a lot of clues (it's a Hebrew name). It's pronounced as two syllables, the first is like "Yo" in yonder, the second "av" as in the first syllable of "avril" in Spanish. I'm guessing that ioav won't cut it because of the three consecutive vowels, so should it be io,av. Also am I supposed to capitalize the second syllable (io,AV) to show where the stress is every time, or is that optional?

If you want the stress putting in on your name I'd keep the capital AV. 

Second, I've read that lojban names have to end in a consonant, so if they don't, we add one.  My question is, do we pronounce the 's' in la meiris ?

Technically, names have been updated since lojban for beginners was written.  I suggest that you join us on the  lojban irc ( http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=Lojban+IRC&bl) where there's always someone who is passionately annoyed that L4B is so out of date. Essentially there are cmene which is anything that is a name. I may point at a dog that I may name in English as "Mr Dog" I may call it {la gerku} in lojban (we often use curly brackets to quote lojban text within natural language text). There {gerku} is acting as a cmene and definitely does not require a final consonant. However, what English uses for "proper nouns" lojban essentially uses "cmevla". This is a cmene that which ends in a consonant. Generally these mean nothing but what they point to as a name. So {cmacis} can have interpretations forced on it, but it means me!

As for the final s, if it is written in lojban then it is pronounced. This is a feature!

Third, I've seen that  the apostrophe is used to make an 'h' sound, whereas the h character is not used.  Why is that?  Why didn't the inventors of lojban (or does it date back to loglan?) simply use an h for the h sound?

Because the ' is a special letter. It is only used to separate vowel pairs. It is given this special symbol so that people don't confuse it with a normal letter. In the past there was a bit of a fashion for using h or H for ', but that has passed and was before my time.

That's it for now.  I'm sure I'll have more questions as I go on.

mi'e io,AV


Please do share them with us. The lojban irc is a nice place to practise and ask questions.

mu'o mi'e cmacis
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