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Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:56:27 -0700
From: "Joel Shellman" <jshellman@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: geodesic dome
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Some thoughts on this topic (please forgive my newbiness as this is
the beginners list :)

Each of those definitions (at least the ones that are indeed quite
different) could/should have a different word in lojban. So, if your
intention is to state a structure made of triangles, use that type of
word. If your intention is to state a spherical structure of struts,
then a word could be for that.

I'm sorry, I'm new here, but tell me this... if someone knew all the
basic vocabulary and the rules for creating new words, would they have
a good chance of knowing what rekyboldi'u means without any context
when they see it for the first time? What about with context?

I would think one of the wonderful benefits of lojban is that you can
do this--create a word that is very precise in what you mean. Granted,
that would mean an enormous vocabulary, thus my question--can someone
decompose a word they've never seen before and most likely understand
what it should mean?

For example, in Japanese, sometimes someone will say a difficult word
or something, and they can figure out what it means because of the
composition of the word. Sometimes, they'll even "air" draw the kanji
and the other person will then get it. Perhaps a curious result of an
ideographic writing system? Okay, we do this in English somewhat too
(not as much in interactive conversation, though, I think)--which is
why those who have studied latin/greek/etc. can have an edge up on
understanding new words.

So... back to the original poster of the question: when you ask about
a word for geodesic, what precisely do you want to say (which
definition do you mean), and pick the word that means that precisely.
I would expect we would not have a 1-1 correspondence between words in
different langages.

Is there a problem with this? Would the vocabulary proliferation be
too difficult? I think that comes back to how hard it is to decipher
newly created words.

So, what are the 15 (or however many) words for snow in lojban? Could
lojban then provide a superset of all languages?


On 10/25/07, Robert LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org> wrote:
> The debate on how to translate geodesic reveals one of the critical
> problems that makes translation difficult, especially when dealing with
> texts that involve specialist terms or jargon.  We don't know exactly
> what the English words mean, and our translations can be no better than
> our guesses as to the meaning.
>
>
> Lest it be helpful, here is what Merriam Webster has as the definition
> of "geodesic" as an adjective used with "dome".  Note that this is
> different from the noun, which is defined as a mathematical term.
>
> 2 : made of light straight structural elements mostly in tension <a
> geodesic dome>
>
> Some other definitions that Google came up with.  Note that only one of
> these definitions mentions triangles:
>
> geodesic dome
> n.
> A domed or vaulted structure of straight elements that form interlocking
> polygons.
>
> a dome built according to the principles of geodetic construction
> patented by R. Buckminster Fuller from the New York Times, March 20,
> 1959: The ...
> www.columbia.edu/cu/gsapp/BT/DOMES/GLOSSRY/gloss.html
>
> A dome constructed according to the patents of R. Buckminster Fuller, in
> which the pattern of surface divisions is always a function of an entire
> sphere. Commonly constructed with prefabricated structural triangles
> linked together in a mosaic to create the domed shape.
> www.wisbuild.org/wisbuild/resource+center/building+glossary/default.asp
>
> Hemispherical dome made of prefabricated geometrically shaped units
> interconnecting to give stability in all directions.
> www.dreamghar.com/gdic.html
>
> Invented by Buckminster Fuller. Have the advantage that these can be
> placed directly on the ground as a complete structure and have few
> limitations of size.
> www.unistates.com/rmt/explained/glossary/rmtglossaryghijk.html
>
> A rounded structure made of short, straight, triangular sections that
> form polygons.
> roofgenius.com/RoofInfo/Roof-Terminology.asp
>
> A structure constructed of lightweight bars forming a grid of polygons.
> modestoarearealestate.com/home_advice/glossary_of_terms/glossary-g.htm
>
> a lightweight dome constructed of interlocking polygons; invented by R.
> Buckminster Fuller
> wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
>
> A geodesic dome is an almost spherical structure based on a network of
> struts arranged on great circles (geodesics) lying approximately on the
> surface of a sphere. ...
> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geodesic dome