Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:39:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1ImXN2-0005DJ-ET for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:21:44 -0700 Received: from express.cec.wustl.edu ([128.252.21.16]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1ImXMw-0005Cs-Jp for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:21:44 -0700 Received: from hive.cec.wustl.edu (hive.cec.wustl.edu [128.252.21.14]) by express.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.6/8.12.5) with ESMTP id l9TGLUFn020725 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:21:30 -0500 (CDT) Received: from hive.cec.wustl.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by hive.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l9TGLUfZ011828; Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:21:30 -0500 Received: from localhost (adam@localhost) by hive.cec.wustl.edu (8.13.1/8.13.1/Submit) with ESMTP id l9TGLUIb011825; Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:21:30 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: hive.cec.wustl.edu: adam owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:21:30 -0500 (CDT) From: "Adam D. Lopresto" To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Quick Reference Guide for language words In-Reply-To: <925d17560710281413s31c912f5recf84ba439dac4b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <975a94850710270735t210f5212s8d39dd0003c08578@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560710270759i39867469o9ff60e75905c59c0@mail.gmail.com> <2204fa080710270924k2a9b6cbby3b2926a935773b9f@mail.gmail.com> <975a94850710271658m5bdfbb23y7a0c7b271ad5acba@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560710281413s31c912f5recf84ba439dac4b@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="-58716651-1073957606-1193674890=:9461" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text, while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools. X-archive-position: 5746 X-Approved-By: jkominek@miranda.org X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: adam@pubcrawler.org Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Content-Length: 1782 ---58716651-1073957606-1193674890=:9461 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by express.cec.wustl.edu id l9TGLUFn020725 On Sun, 28 Oct 2007, Jorge Llamb=C3=ADas wrote: > On 10/27/07, Joel Shellman wrote: > > > > > sumti: an argument in a sentence. > > > > I'm going to say "argument to a selbri in a bridi" as that can be > > stated without qualification, I assume. >=20 > That's correct as a definition of what the Lojban word {sumti} means. >=20 > It's not quite right as a description of how the word "sumti" is used > as jargon in English when talking about Lojban. We normally tend to > use "sumti" to talk about a type of construct, such as {mi}, {lo mlatu}= , > {lo nu mi klama}, etc, whether they are being arguments to any selbri > or not. Roughly that corresponds to "noun phrase" in English, which > may be used as arguments of verbs but also in several other functions. >=20 > For example, in {xu do pu djuno la'e di'u doi lo mi pendo}, we would > say, in English, that {di'u}, {lo mi pendo} and {mi} are "sumti", even > though they are not the arguments to any selbri, so they are not being > sumti in the Lojban sense of the word, only in the English jargon sense > of the word. Another way to put it is that in English we (well, I) use "sumti" where i= n Lojban {ka'e sumti} would probably be more appropriate. But without an explicit CAhA, I don't think it's too far wrong; it's just one of the rar= e cases where {ka'e} is implicit instead of {ca'a}. --=20 Adam Lopresto http://cec.wustl.edu/~adam/ Red meat is NOT bad for you. Now, blue-green meat, that's REALLY BAD for you. --Tommy Smothers ---58716651-1073957606-1193674890=:9461--