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Message-ID: <925d17560711050717h4147b9do87ec5b45d43bded1@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 12:17:02 -0300
From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" <jjllambias@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: beginner questions
In-Reply-To: <472EB814.7040102@salkin.org>
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On 11/5/07, Steve Salkin <steve@salkin.org> wrote:
>
> ni'o lei se morji be mi cu kalsa mutce
> which seems to parse
> <start paragraph>the mass of memories I recall are chaotic in aspect
> extremeness.

That would have to be {kalsa lo ka mutce} instead of {kalsa mutce}.

> I would have thought it would work:
> ni'o lei se morji be mi mutce kalse (are extreme in property disorder).

That would be {mutce lo ka kalsa}.

{kalsa mutce} is a shortened form of {mutce lo ka kalsa}, where {mutce}
is the main selbri and {kalsa} the modifier.

> (2) Do people really find constructions that mix speaker's time and
> sentence time to be fine in usage? For example, "mi puzuze'a gunka" from
> LFB;

{pu zu} indicates the time when the working takes place, {ze'a} indicates
the duration of the working. They are both "sentence times". {pu zu} may
often be taken to be relative to the speaker's time, but it need not be. It
just says "long before (some unspecified reference point)".

>would the usage "puzuku mi ze'a gunka" seem more awkward in Lojban?

That's also fine.

> While I don't find it so awkward to have the time and space both given
> in the same spot, having two different kinds of time orientation given
> together like that is still feeling very odd to me.

{ze'a} is for the duration of the event, {zu} is for its location in time,
they are not different time orientations.

mu'o mi'e xorxes