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Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 01:42:05 -0500
From: "komfo,amonan" <komfoamonan@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org
Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: towns and countries
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On Jan 9, 2008 12:54 AM, Penguino <spheniscine@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm actually in favor of relaxing the phonotactic rules governing *cmevla*,
> allowing names like [la moskvas.], [la petalindjaias.], and [la djeimz.],
> even though they contain consonant clusters forbidden in other words. After
> all, we already allow names like [la prjevalskis.] or [la pskof.]. This
> would make things easier for beginners, who are often taught how to make *
> cmevla* first.
>

{ndj} {mz} and {kv} cannot be reliably distinguished aurally from {nj} {mbz}
and {kf}/{gv}. I believe that's why those clusters shake out like that.

Another thing I find to be problematic is the [la, lai, la'i, doi]
> restriction. [la] is a very common syllable in Malaysian names. Although I
> could render Kuala Lumpur as [la kualylumpur.], names like Selangor
> [sylanor] prove to be more problematic, since the [la] is stressed, and
> would suffer if replaced by [ly]. Solutions I've considered include
> splitting up the name [la syl.anor.], or modifying the word to place a
> consonant before [la], [la slanor.]. On the other hand, the original name
> couldn't break up into [la sy la nor.], since [sy] would require a pause
> (However it does break up in *la jbofi'e*), so perhaps it can be left well
> alone, along with [la srilankas.], which also cannot break up. But that
> would greatly complicate the *cmevla* morphological rules.


I have generally solved the {-la-} problem in cmevla by including a
diphthong. Hence, Javier Solanas --> {xavier. soluanas.} Sri Lanka -->
{sriluankas.}

mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan

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On Jan 9, 2008 12:54 AM, Penguino &lt;<a href="mailto:spheniscine@gmail.com">spheniscine@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
I&#39;m actually in favor of relaxing the phonotactic rules governing <i>cmevla</i>, allowing names like [la moskvas.], [la petalindjaias.], and [la djeimz.], even though they contain consonant clusters forbidden in other words. After all, we already allow names like [la prjevalskis.] or [la pskof.]. This would make things easier for beginners, who are often taught how to make 
<i>cmevla</i> first.<br></blockquote><div><br>{ndj} {mz} and {kv} cannot be reliably distinguished aurally from {nj} {mbz} and {kf}/{gv}. I believe that&#39;s why those clusters shake out like that.<br><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Another thing I find to be problematic is the [la, lai, la&#39;i, doi] restriction. [la] is a very common syllable in Malaysian names. Although I could render Kuala Lumpur as [la kualylumpur.], names like Selangor [sylanor] prove to be more problematic, since the [la] is stressed, and would suffer if replaced by [ly]. Solutions I&#39;ve considered include splitting up the name [la 
syl.anor.], or modifying the word to place a consonant before [la], [la slanor.]. On the other hand, the original name couldn&#39;t break up into [la sy la nor.], since [sy] would require a pause (However it does break up in 
<i>la jbofi&#39;e</i>), so perhaps it can be left well alone, along with [la srilankas.], which also cannot break up. But that would greatly complicate the <i>cmevla</i> morphological rules.</blockquote><div><br>I have generally solved the {-la-} problem in cmevla by including a diphthong. Hence, Javier Solanas --&gt; {xavier. soluanas.} Sri Lanka --&gt; {sriluankas.} 
<br><br>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e komfo,amonan<br></div></div>

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