Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-beginners); Fri, 18 Sep 2009 08:16:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MofCQ-0007wb-9e for lojban-beginners-real@lojban.org; Fri, 18 Sep 2009 08:16:39 -0700 Received: from mail-ew0-f216.google.com ([209.85.219.216]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1MofCK-0007uG-H3 for lojban-beginners@lojban.org; Fri, 18 Sep 2009 08:16:37 -0700 Received: by ewy12 with SMTP id 12so1120134ewy.0 for ; Fri, 18 Sep 2009 08:16:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:in-reply-to:references :date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=/3wBFQvp0tcTd5YQndPGtlA0sYMOwhgsdawQR/yfyfI=; b=QxVUmGUV5U0km2QyI9dzMHtBVFAm3ctyZEuLOamPUFIPoTWHqC5rTZDuIfiK2Mtvpz Ex5JAM9TnYe3wXLCOk14wktf5Eju1emFn8sutsqIMR6b0IXcczFqzsH5qFvJEjhgTg/y DZ5jr41HpZ/PeGM5DlLPChCfOye5Bd+FiZ1tY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; b=caCJc/4OGT3oz2G5pjy819n+5LhLmjNVqt0u8HkxsjneFUt2YWYVZRlavpuqh9o7Lr H79N12pWEmad0uy/Bi2t/CcpNXlRuIDC6x5/u9Qfg0mH095Si/InnUzVIo2TdVkBjCuX hEzcijFtnpc/ACHdshCWgzm2pvCL+6T3CjEJY= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.210.9.13 with SMTP id 13mr1206064ebi.3.1253286983823; Fri, 18 Sep 2009 08:16:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <7f1d42860909180804h2bc0e42wd230b733544978cf@mail.gmail.com> References: <7f1d42860909171135p21b10ac9x4759450c9721ac0c@mail.gmail.com> <200909172244.32493.phma@phma.optus.nu> <7f1d42860909180804h2bc0e42wd230b733544978cf@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Sep 2009 17:16:23 +0200 Message-ID: Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: attempt at translation From: Johan Pretorius To: lojban-beginners@lojban.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0ce0f45678f0680473db9d41 X-archive-position: 2373 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-beginners-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: pretoriusjf@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-beginners@lojban.org X-list: lojban-beginners Content-Length: 7507 --000e0ce0f45678f0680473db9d41 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable coi ro do At a bit of a tangent: I looked up ki'e in jbovlaste, and saw it's defined as: vocative: thanks - no thanks to you. > I've seen this sort of thing in many other places (in jbovlaste), and never understand exactly the intended meaning is. Could someone please clarify for me whether ki'e means "thanks" or "no thanks to you", or if I'm just completely misunderstanding? >From context, of course, it's clear Ryan meant to say "thanks". So what's up with the other half of the definition? mu'o On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 at 5:04 PM, Ryan Leach wrote: > ki'e .pier. > > I have developed a tendency to mix up tricu and troci, and noticed it > as soon as you pointed it out. > > If I understand you correctly, then in order to indicate possession, I > must include both the "le" and the "mi"- as in "mi batci le mi gerku". > I thought that the 'le' was elidable- I appreciate the correction. > > It also looks as though I am overusing cmavo to modify the sentence > compared with how you wrote it. Would you agree that this is the case? > > Also, I looked up ra'o in jbovlaste and am not certain that I > understand it. What exactly is a 'pro-assignment context update'? > > I am going to try to retranslate the selection using your corrections > as a guide and then re post it here. Thank you for the assistance. > > ki.e > > .rai.yn > > > On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 7:44 PM, Pierre Abbat wrote: > > On Thursday 17 September 2009 14:35:55 Ryan Leach wrote: > >> I am trying to translate english stories. I believe that this is good > >> practise. > >> > >> .i mi tricu fanva le glico lisri .i mi jimpe du'o nu xamgu tadni .i > > > > "tricu" means "tree". do skudji zo troci. The second sentence means "I > > understand, which is known by event of good study" (needs "le" before > "nu" to > > parse). I'd say something like "pe'i la'e di'u nu xamgu tadni". > > > >> ----------------------------------------------- > >> > >> I've written mi translation next. > >> > >> mi ciska mi fanva cu di'e .i > > > > ki'a? .i lu mi ciska di'e no'u le mi xelfanva li'u > > > >> ------------------------------------------------ > >> > >> lu mi pu tirna da'e ra'i da'e goi mi pa'upatfu .ije mi pa'upatfu go'e > >> .ije do'i rapli nu so'i pano nanca .i > > > > I was stumped by the first sentence, but it parses. It means "=ABI hear= d it > > (which is something I'll say later) from it (which is something I'll sa= y > > later) which is I=BB is a father with a component". That is, the quotat= ion > is a > > father with an unspecified component. Here's how I'd say it: > > > > mi tirna da'e ra'i le mi pafpa'u .i ri tirna da'e ra'i le vo'a pafpa'u = .i > ri > > go'i ra'o .i la'e di'u rapli ca'o lo ctona'a be li so'i > > > > mu'omi'e .pier. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > =93Nothing bothers me more than sloth. The objective is to fix mistakes > of ambition and not make mistakes of sloth. I work my ass off.=94 > -Tim Ferriss > > > > --000e0ce0f45678f0680473db9d41 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable coi ro do

At a bit of a tangent:=A0 I looked up ki'e in jbovlast= e, and saw it's defined as:

vocative: thanks - no thanks to you.

I've seen this= sort of thing in many other places (in jbovlaste), and never understand ex= actly the intended meaning is.=A0 Could someone please clarify for me wheth= er ki'e means "thanks" or "no thanks to you", or if= I'm just completely misunderstanding?

From context, of course, it's clear Ryan meant to say "thanks&= quot;.=A0 So what's up with the other half of the definition?

mu= 'o




On Fri, Sep 18, 2009 a= t 5:04 PM, Ryan Leach <rsw.leach@gmail.com> wrote:
ki'e .pier.
I have developed a tendency to mix up tricu and troci, and noticed it
as soon as you pointed it out.

If I understand you correctly, then in order to indicate possession, I
must include both the "le" and the "mi"- as in "mi= batci le mi gerku".
I thought that the 'le' was elidable- I appreciate the correction.<= br>
It also looks as though I am overusing cmavo to modify the sentence
compared with how you wrote it. Would you agree that this is the case?

Also, I looked up ra'o in jbovlaste and am not certain that I
understand it. What exactly is a 'pro-assignment context update'?
I am going to try to retranslate the selection using your corrections
as a guide and then re post it here. Thank you for the assistance.

ki.e

.rai.yn


On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 7:44 PM, Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu> wrote:
> On Thursday 17 September 2009 14:35:55 Ryan Leach wrote:
>> I am trying to translate english stories. I believe that this is g= ood
>> practise.
>>
>> .i mi tricu fanva le glico lisri .i mi jimpe du'o nu xamgu tad= ni .i
>
> "tricu" means "tree". do skudji zo troci. The seco= nd sentence means "I
> understand, which is known by event of good study" (needs "l= e" before "nu" to
> parse). I'd say something like "pe'i la'e di'u nu= xamgu tadni".
>
>> -----------------------------------------------
>>
>> I've written mi translation next.
>>
>> mi ciska mi fanva cu di'e .i
>
> ki'a? .i lu mi ciska di'e no'u le mi xelfanva li'u
>
>> ------------------------------------------------
>>
>> lu mi pu tirna da'e ra'i da'e goi mi pa'upatfu .ij= e mi pa'upatfu go'e
>> .ije do'i rapli nu so'i pano nanca .i
>
> I was stumped by the first sentence, but it parses. It means "=AB= I heard it
> (which is something I'll say later) from it (which is something I&= #39;ll say
> later) which is I=BB is a father with a component". That is, the = quotation is a
> father with an unspecified component. Here's how I'd say it: >
> mi tirna da'e ra'i le mi pafpa'u .i ri tirna da'e ra&#= 39;i le vo'a pafpa'u .i ri
> go'i ra'o .i la'e di'u rapli ca'o lo ctona'a b= e li so'i
>
> mu'omi'e .pier.
>
>
>
>



--
=93Nothing bothers me more than sloth. The objective is to fix mistakes
of ambition and not make mistakes of sloth. I work my ass off.=94
-Tim Ferriss




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