Received: from mail-ww0-f61.google.com ([74.125.82.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O6WnX-0003Xq-VK; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:29:10 -0700 Received: by wwe15 with SMTP id 15sf343899wwe.16 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=hlv6jEaQfP5t48StUbu1Y1x1bk6oqHeEPwATqzci6uk=; b=CqEnnMFNi53PFeRW1ftTiuJrUont6MUJ0pekPbPvvzIC4FE2lxXLfjrfmScs9M/Wri dsaigZG+lHOchpK96xEu835PQn0qBjXmA+bR9X6OdezFSN6QDZY7oR4cnGR6rkAXzhEN E5OUKO8B2rZALxeUrQo4IJxZrypJTBxUGoG1Q= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=iAjN4MjeFoTL+7vD62I6mQPsUdKG3EbIfMRmT3M7fusxurV4RCBxdc7+49x/IG47Ck 82sUcJmT3/jFDZdS/NfpRAgBZwd9+2mp38B3PBiIKBIDUK5kKLZUghPF32endNlL2r/l aQFLqvz0rUvs6o+opf3vPhxUasBGIm7aIct+c= Received: by 10.223.64.212 with SMTP id f20mr1409809fai.18.1272320933989; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:53 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.204.32.206 with SMTP id e14ls15690805bkd.2.p; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.76.203 with SMTP id d11mr138515vck.11.1272320931646; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.76.203 with SMTP id d11mr138514vck.11.1272320931618; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qy0-f171.google.com (mail-qy0-f171.google.com [209.85.221.171]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id b14si3278506vcx.1.2010.04.26.15.28.50; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:50 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.221.171 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.221.171; Received: by qyk1 with SMTP id 1so16304734qyk.15 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.228.83 with SMTP id jd19mr5886884qcb.72.1272320928425; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.229.82.11 with HTTP; Mon, 26 Apr 2010 15:28:48 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2010 19:28:48 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] enzima & encima etc. From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.221.171 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1459 2010/4/26 tijlan : > If I were to Lojbanize Spanish "enzima" and "encima", should I use the sa= me > lerfu for the same sound "z" and "c", resulting in the same spelling? If = so, > which lerfu? In general, if you are going by pronunciation, the obvious choice for Spanish "z" or "ce"/"ci" is "s", since that's how most speakers of Spanish pronounce them, and in any case the voiceless dental fricative [=E8] of (some regions of) Spain does not exist is Lojban, so you have to choose some approximation and "s" is the obvious choice. For the particular example, "encima" is not the kind of word we should be borrowing from any language, even if we didn't already have "cpana" it would be the kind of word that should most likely be done with a lujvo. If I were making a fu'ivla for "enzima" I might go with ".enzima", but it would be a coincidence that it was spelled just like in Spanish, the reason would be that that is a good "average" from looking at many languages. There seems to be no reason to borrow this word directly from Spanish. mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.