Received: from mail-wy0-f189.google.com ([74.125.82.189]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1O7pgS-0003vc-B1; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:51:13 -0700 Received: by wyb36 with SMTP id 36sf124434wyb.16 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:received :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=2EIANoy1oR654QusJv2oTgzaEjQnTAfRpziQALUmwN0=; b=Vnk+SzLv3LKv7HMCn3VkpsfCJLQcUKmiloTE8JlMX6pKCVrHoUuO2rQMxX8AENlSe5 wXI3h2C1+8mk38mAFiv2aTvBDN7SZLEc9Pa9uqqMg7lQyTfF4Q8RjUXJcFrazirI/Kkm NFmIlt5YUqTvYMZcbgQdOhASEebTqzyI0av4Y= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=QWUXLuusEJggj4FNFpcBHD6pFegXnTWZ86Ma+SB17XtqWkxk4ODouaTG2gatCU9PXG XdNlxZ7pR5O5Lrp4Fcc+yTfX09dWWqXHBpWjo91ww9jXJ7N8BnWq2oI79pxIJlHd5Rwu dCTw55T0O/wRTEMKlozsHgnr7BZHBId5KqClo= Received: by 10.223.13.196 with SMTP id d4mr1751318faa.23.1272631856432; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:56 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.204.32.206 with SMTP id e14ls21744851bkd.2.p; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.140.13 with SMTP id g13mr553562bku.20.1272631853781; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.204.140.13 with SMTP id g13mr553559bku.20.1272631853614; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-fx0-f41.google.com (mail-fx0-f41.google.com [209.85.161.41]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 12si265986bwz.5.2010.04.30.05.50.52; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:52 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.41 as permitted sender) client-ip=209.85.161.41; Received: by mail-fx0-f41.google.com with SMTP id 1so144958fxm.14 for ; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:52 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.87.47.3 with SMTP id z3mr3882127fgj.74.1272631852288; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.86.76.2 with HTTP; Fri, 30 Apr 2010 05:50:52 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <4BD94677.6060909@lojban.org> Date: Fri, 30 Apr 2010 09:50:52 -0300 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Conditionals--da'i etc. From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 209.85.161.41 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Length: 1325 On Thu, Apr 29, 2010 at 8:03 PM, Ian Johnson wrote= : > Related question: how is nibli defined, exactly? Based on what I've learn= ed > in logic-heavy math classes, this should be true: > > .i lo du'u broda cu nibli lo du'u brode .ijo ganai broda gi brode > > Is it? Not really. The nibli-statement on the left is a much stronger statement than the material implication connective on the right. Suppose: broda =3D Eyjafjallaj=F6kull is a volcano in Iceland. brode =3D Paris is the capital of France. Both "broda" and "brode" happen to be true, so "ganai broda gi brode" is also true. But "lo du'u broda cu nibli lo du'u brode" says that starting from "broda", and applying the logical rules of inference (implicit in the x3 of nibli, let's assume the usual ones) then you can infer "brode". But you can't really infer "Paris is the capital of France" from "Eyjafjallaj=F6kull is a volcano in Iceland". mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.