If anybody is willing to help tic= kle my curiosity, please reply with your general location and if you say &q= uot;rider" and "writer" identically.

On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 12:35 PM, Oren <get.oren@gmail.com> wrote:

Aha. Wikipedia speaks, I am in fact just a very sheltered = freak:
http://en.wikipedia.o= rg/wiki/North_American_English_regional_phonology#Canadian_raising

"the General American pronunciations of=C2=A0= rider=C2=A0and=C2=A0writer=C2=A0are identical = ([=C9=B9a=C9=AA=C9=BE=C9=9A]), those American English speaker= s whose dialects include either the full or restricted Canadian raising wil= l pronounce them as=C2=A0[=C9=B9a=C9=AA=C9=BE=C9=9A]=C2=A0= and=C2=A0[=C9=B9=C9=99=C9=AA=C9=BE=C9=9A], respectively= . Canadian raising is quite strong in most of Ontario and the Maritimes as = well as in the Prairies. It is receding in British Columbia, and many of th= ese speakers do not raise=C2=A0/a=C9=AA/=C2=A0before vo= iceless consonants."

Apparently Syracuse, New York qualifies as sufficiently Cana= dian.

On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 12:11, MorphemeAddict <<= a href=3D"mailto:lytlesw@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">lytlesw@gmail.com= > wrote:

My Midwest USA accent has no difference= TTBOMK between the vowels of "bold" and "so". Nor are = they different in "pie" and "pipe", as a later post ass= erts.

=C2=A0

stevo=C2=A0

On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 1:53 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:

Why exactly is this bad, timos?=C2=A0 The cll does it because how else c= an we explain to nintadni that "o" says english "bold" = not "so"?

I find that now that I have a pretty good grasp of lojban pronounciation= , I have a new tool to help me better communicate differences of accent.=C2= =A0

Ideally I should just get off my lazy arse and learn IPA though :(

i.e.=C2=A0 lojban vowels don't help me to describe the difference in= pronounciation of "b[o]ston".

But the difference between english "pie" and "pipe" = is most certainly distinguishable using lojban vowels (the difference being= "pai" vs and "pyip").=C2=A0 Just try saying "pie&= quot; in english followed quickly by the "p" sound and you will h= ear that it sounds funny and distinctly not like "pipe"

On Jan 22, 2011 1:29 PM, "Timo Paulssen&quo= t; <timonator@perpetuum-immobile.de> wrote:

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<= div>102 Morrison Ave
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