Received: from mail-qw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.216.61])
	by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72)
	(envelope-from <lojban-beginners+bncCNTPpI2KGxCDo_bqBBoEusSQRQ@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1PqBIz-0004Hk-N1; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:35 -0800
Received: by qwd6 with SMTP id 6sf7726252qwd.16
        for <multiple recipients>; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:23 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis
         :x-cloudmark-score:x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent
         :references:in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe
         :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition;
        bh=r9YBvy09xv/MeSo4ea4SVdLfwQ336u3sgGSfgcdPjtk=;
        b=O6e4hoanN3GKVt4cXNouvFM72AtQtLdZpUsmvWsZVmRqpGMui88bPVjLZ/ViT9jcZM
         LZCRSmWXcfd5tOPEgWyMUEBH6k4nZ5EdT9647nSIcgllxK573pUkjaGb46xO+JCsuS28
         PkokInj/KJnJ2ZBUGMCYI24ccz85aKYTY37l4=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-authority-analysis:x-cloudmark-score
         :x-originating-ip:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:references
         :in-reply-to:mime-version:message-id:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe
         :list-unsubscribe:content-type:content-disposition;
        b=l9eSSx/LS2G9hWyXebO/oLvBhESYfJUbGHZJpH9MqtPBWEauuQ48/du0nhmQ8DVGnH
         eitxKde0QoZKdOig4VGJUEfPICx5YueJX1HPGsq78WBGvsykVg4juG/mpsubIIxmFQ+O
         ZmCK7fyyCbwNjnQTGZJFsYArx8BWv6uwME5Ic=
Received: by 10.229.30.213 with SMTP id v21mr511705qcc.35.1297977731300;
        Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:11 -0800 (PST)
X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.229.70.202 with SMTP id e10ls1026185qcj.1.p; Thu, 17 Feb 2011
 13:22:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.229.136.81 with SMTP id q17mr623921qct.28.1297977730302;
        Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.229.136.81 with SMTP id q17mr623920qct.28.1297977730280;
        Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: from cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com (cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com [75.180.132.120])
        by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 19si277349qci.1.2011.02.17.13.22.08;
        Thu, 17 Feb 2011 13:22:08 -0800 (PST)
Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 75.180.132.120 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) client-ip=75.180.132.120;
X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.1 cv=pepdxKapwHuwCZNFD5uob2wvham6E+RljB0uXw08FdQ= c=1 sm=0 a=Ubv3xljnCsIA:10 a=wPDyFdB5xvgA:10 a=Q9fys5e9bTEA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:17 a=95AqYrxebdTkHRdl-gIA:9 a=QO3yxdpeluUBQFPz9EZnG5BTf-0A:4 a=PUjeQqilurYA:10 a=9o99xeNKNPYSmM5t9x5+TQ==:117
X-Cloudmark-Score: 0
X-Originating-IP: 75.176.118.168
Received: from [75.176.118.168] ([75.176.118.168:39223] helo=chausie)
	by cdptpa-oedge03.mail.rr.com (envelope-from <phma@phma.optus.nu>)
	(ecelerity 2.2.3.46 r()) with ESMTP
	id 7C/11-19545-F719D5D4; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 21:22:08 +0000
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by chausie (Postfix) with ESMTP id F02DB10F42
	for <lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com>; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 16:22:05 -0500 (EST)
From: Pierre Abbat <phma@phma.optus.nu>
To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Question about {roda}
Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 16:22:01 -0500
User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405)
References: <AANLkTimpzxxJpOSRnmX1s-wuoTJNYEU9YP3ZjXATitgF@mail.gmail.com> <201102171403.40004.phma@phma.optus.nu> <AANLkTimQYOAwhcRs8FDk88VJPB-fGADYwKwGTRmt2hrR@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTimQYOAwhcRs8FDk88VJPB-fGADYwKwGTRmt2hrR@mail.gmail.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-Id: <201102171622.02738.phma@phma.optus.nu>
X-Original-Sender: phma@phma.optus.nu
X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com:
 75.180.132.120 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for
 domain of phma@phma.optus.nu) smtp.mail=phma@phma.optus.nu
Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban-beginners.googlegroups.com>
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:lojban-beginners+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Length: 1552

On Thursday 17 February 2011 15:58:43 .arpis. wrote:
> I was aware that {roda} isn't restricted to people or physical objects, but
> it's difficult to express that in English.
>
> It's interesting that you refer to a "universe of discourse".  Not having
> any strong background in linguistics, philosophy, or logic, I don't know
> what precisely this means, but it seems like it's what I'm thinking about.
>
> In English, when I say "Everyone's going home.", I am first of all probably
> exaggerating but second of all I really mean "Everyone [of the set who
> isn't me in the relevant location] is going home".  It's like I said "roda
> [poi co'e] cu cliva".
>
> Does the universe of discourse always consist of all things that can
> possibly be talked about?

No. Suppose five people meet at my house and we discuss computers and also 
mention each other. As the conversation winds down, I say "ro da cu 
zdakla". "ro da" refers to both computers and the five of us, but does not 
include the planet Saturn or a unicorn. I could say "ro zo'e cu zdakla", 
leaving it up to the listener to grice what "zo'e" refers to.

Pierre
-- 
Don't buy a French car in Holland. It may be a citroen.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.