Received: from mail-pw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.160.61])
	by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.72)
	(envelope-from <lojban-beginners+bncCML0xpmUARCztoLrBBoE5QemUQ@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1Pr165-0000sN-BX; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:41 -0800
Received: by pwi1 with SMTP id 1sf255074pwi.16
        for <multiple recipients>; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:30 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=domainkey-signature:x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version
         :in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to
         :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to
         :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive
         :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type;
        bh=cKYQdCZcYH0PBHoBlrisqmzHJkBONUUGF5TS7vCmHHU=;
        b=YQiW1bqG7ngS+LGUb6t6IC5uJ99Ul3vzP7pxxyXW4ue9cKEFx2jGY5Ej5jmMkhXvxH
         PofjxxtRKXN8n9YtmyecrPUsyYtIDb7RqCguZucbvu6XOXDFJ387+M9DXvUflhHrXfVX
         K3p9rrHBcGoYEN+wXlHmbtsZo2A67osF0XTjM=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=beta;
        h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date
         :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-sender
         :x-original-authentication-results:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list
         :list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe
         :list-unsubscribe:content-type;
        b=lFfZ0TpAkuInDVfo4QajqOp+jNeE0ElAJRg9knTG++HhyWynMuAOvPG6QkZwlt2FYu
         lQwXdVaFftLN13GLRxWFaJdLIU8jZY+1BA4GHyjx/ZWxFdwEQN+Z17OPhprv6wjk5BKG
         xtzWtlfKXi7CnSVyIavAy2Lc167eXGY+T0Xw4=
Received: by 10.142.200.14 with SMTP id x14mr504wff.33.1298176819825;
        Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:19 -0800 (PST)
X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.142.201.17 with SMTP id y17ls5385260wff.1.p; Sat, 19 Feb 2011
 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.142.76.3 with SMTP id y3mr2137wfa.54.1298176818835;
        Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.142.76.3 with SMTP id y3mr2136wfa.54.1298176818803;
        Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-pv0-f173.google.com (mail-pv0-f173.google.com [74.125.83.173])
        by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 28si4180234wfb.2.2011.02.19.20.40.18
        (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER);
        Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of blindbravado@gmail.com designates 74.125.83.173 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.83.173;
Received: by pvg3 with SMTP id 3so375743pvg.4
        for <lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com>; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.142.162.20 with SMTP id k20mr19148wfe.87.1298176818583; Sat,
 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: by 10.142.53.5 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 20:40:18 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTik6SL-jiRm_dUSnjML_4oqUq8yd2vHyMkUp4jm+@mail.gmail.com>
References: <AANLkTi=Wh_wOo=ckxiC_vT6BCefU4aWDcJV+gXujoprh@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimQ3t3WhRqPkNzKTqbNW7XO4O-OmbEM=XS1sYA7@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTimu7BAv4U0aN3+oxDmZWTBQ=SWxaN1uer29oihb@mail.gmail.com>
	<AANLkTik6SL-jiRm_dUSnjML_4oqUq8yd2vHyMkUp4jm+@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2011 23:40:18 -0500
Message-ID: <AANLkTinod+PyrGbzPYiq3jmBovysHLX+p8DiY06RE=0q@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] lujvo making help request
From: Ian Johnson <blindbravado@gmail.com>
To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
X-Original-Sender: blindbravado@gmail.com
X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com:
 domain of blindbravado@gmail.com designates 74.125.83.173 as permitted
 sender) smtp.mail=blindbravado@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com
Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban-beginners.googlegroups.com>
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:lojban-beginners+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd1535a2097d1049caf58b4
Content-Length: 5325

--000e0cd1535a2097d1049caf58b4
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I think they are, because that other thing, the thing I described, is a
relevant possibility in this discussion in general. Plus, {cevni zasti djuno
tolcu'i krici} and {cevni zasti tolcu'i djuno krici} yield lujvo of
essentially the same length--you don't need ke/ke'e or bo.

mu'o mi'e .latros.

On Sat, Feb 19, 2011 at 10:52 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:

> I forgot that part in the lujvo. Oops.
>
> Right, (((god existence)(impossible knowing))belief). Lujvo don't /have/ to
> include the rafsi for every gismu in the source bridi. I left out the
> tanru-super -scope cmavo in the tanru because I couldn't remember it and
> didn't think they were vitally needed for understanding.
>
> On Feb 19, 2011 6:45 PM, "Ian Johnson" <blindbravado@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Where'd tolcu'i go?
>
> Also, if you look at the tanru grouping, you have:
> (((god-kind-of-exist)-kind-of-impossible)-kind-of-know)-kind-of-believe
> which seems to be "believe that you can know that it's impossible for a god
> to exist", to me. {cevni zasti djuno tolcu'i krici} seems like the right
> tanru, with the lujvo changing analogously.
>
> mu'o mi'e .latros.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Feb 19, 2011 at 7:54 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > cevni zasti tolcu'i...
>
>  --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Lojban Beginners" group.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.


--000e0cd1535a2097d1049caf58b4
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I think they are, because that other thing, the thing I described, is a rel=
evant possibility in this discussion in general. Plus, {cevni zasti djuno t=
olcu&#39;i krici} and {cevni zasti tolcu&#39;i djuno krici} yield lujvo of =
essentially the same length--you don&#39;t need ke/ke&#39;e or bo.<br>
<br>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e .latros.<br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Fe=
b 19, 2011 at 10:52 PM, Jonathan Jones <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:eyeonus@gmail.com">eyeonus@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquo=
te class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1=
px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<p>I forgot that part in the lujvo. Oops.</p>
<p>Right, (((god existence)(impossible knowing))belief). Lujvo don&#39;t /h=
ave/ to include the rafsi for every gismu in the source bridi. I left out t=
he tanru-super	-scope cmavo in the tanru because I couldn&#39;t remember it=
 and didn&#39;t think they were vitally needed for understanding.</p>


<p></p><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div class=3D"im">On Feb 19, 2011 6:45 PM,=
 &quot;Ian Johnson&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:blindbravado@gmail.com" targ=
et=3D"_blank">blindbravado@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br>Where&#39;d tolc=
u&#39;i go?<br>
<br>Also, if you look at the tanru grouping, you have:<br>
(((god-kind-of-exist)-kind-of-impossible)-kind-of-know)-kind-of-believe<br>=
which seems to be &quot;believe that you can know that it&#39;s impossible =
for a god to exist&quot;, to me. {cevni zasti djuno tolcu&#39;i krici} seem=
s like the right tanru, with the lujvo changing analogously.<br>


<br>mu&#39;o mi&#39;e .latros.</div><p><font color=3D"#500050"><div class=
=3D"im"><br><br>On Sat, Feb 19, 2011 at 7:54 PM, Jonathan Jones &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:eyeonus@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">eyeonus@gmail.com</a>&gt; w=
rote:<br>
&gt;<br></div>&gt; cevni zasti tolcu&#39;i...</font></p>
</blockquote><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5">

<p></p>

-- <br>
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &=
quot;Lojban Beginners&quot; group.<br>
To post to this group, send email to <a href=3D"mailto:lojban-beginners@goo=
glegroups.com" target=3D"_blank">lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com</a>.<br>
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to <a href=3D"mailto:lojban-begi=
nners%2Bunsubscribe@googlegroups.com" target=3D"_blank">lojban-beginners+un=
subscribe@googlegroups.com</a>.<br>

For more options, visit this group at <a href=3D"http://groups.google.com/g=
roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den" target=3D"_blank">http://groups.google.com/g=
roup/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den</a>.<br>


</div></div></blockquote></div><br>

<p></p>

-- <br />
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "=
Lojban Beginners" group.<br />
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.<br =
/>
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@=
googlegroups.com.<br />

For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban=
-beginners?hl=3Den.<br />



--000e0cd1535a2097d1049caf58b4--