Received: from mail-pz0-f61.google.com ([209.85.210.61]:40495)
	by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128)
	(Exim 4.76)
	(envelope-from <lojban-beginners+bncCKu5ssGzBRD5_KOCBRoEG4_eUg@googlegroups.com>)
	id 1T9i5o-0004qD-OK; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:30 -0700
Received: by daek18 with SMTP id k18sf1753027dae.16
        for <multiple recipients>; Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:18 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806;
        h=x-beenthere:received-spf:x-pair-authenticated:message-id:date:from
         :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to
         :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to
         :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post
         :list-help:list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe
         :content-type;
        bh=QhH4EKJEAimO5XKNXH80dcPY2xyW1bVp2buITZELuWc=;
        b=BUexNKPkYewWlpQjM/M0Ae8/HCzkwcPkbRtXJ8Ko23+Vt6hpq6o6O7DU/z6gkaPM6k
         9Ah4ThdxA99FTfNeZcUVvuqn1jJ1DyvgAAL9QHBmGtm+KJV60I1IDr82KJNO9vgIpbfC
         se1I5Uu881VJDcGfERFB1frsh74erXIaDxRDNrAj7JmkaO5mphmrKpASdZWMFpcWTsOu
         9v62GRahzOYETFAAuwmsbQQt0A4j/BxPkW7Kx1OFFU4+pCr/VPVbLcB2WK5PEzW3u3fq
         B89JGypK+anfXVT3C/M7YA89OURHnjwc9YcoRMMDNvKtVl2Z12JTwhPYYhoDX2qHWdq6
         YvwQ==
Received: by 10.50.188.167 with SMTP id gb7mr1801083igc.4.1346961017680;
        Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:17 -0700 (PDT)
X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Received: by 10.50.214.34 with SMTP id nx2ls2651949igc.1.gmail; Thu, 06 Sep
 2012 12:50:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.42.94.16 with SMTP id z16mr1510061icm.32.1346961017048;
        Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.42.94.16 with SMTP id z16mr1510060icm.32.1346961017025;
        Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:17 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from relay00.pair.com (relay00.pair.com. [209.68.5.9])
        by gmr-mx.google.com with SMTP id gv6si1206940igb.0.2012.09.06.12.50.16;
        Thu, 06 Sep 2012 12:50:16 -0700 (PDT)
Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 209.68.5.9 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of m3o@plasmatix.com) client-ip=209.68.5.9;
Received: (qmail 22849 invoked from network); 6 Sep 2012 19:50:15 -0000
Received: from 87.160.147.153 (HELO ?192.168.1.33?) (87.160.147.153)
  by relay00.pair.com with SMTP; 6 Sep 2012 19:50:15 -0000
X-pair-Authenticated: 87.160.147.153
Message-ID: <5048FE76.70008@plasmatix.com>
Date: Thu, 06 Sep 2012 21:50:14 +0200
From: selpa'i <m3o@plasmatix.com>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:15.0) Gecko/20120824 Thunderbird/15.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Where should I use sets and where should I
 use masses?
References: <369b1b83-0407-4ccf-aa59-89a5ffbaf473@googlegroups.com> <CAOQ8VDUCkSVyFRG_4td_EAhiZ3XUO9bbr4-MNprN0oCwptsqRw@mail.gmail.com> <CAPAJj9K4NDjNQZnkiF2UXaAtHjsnswwsgpCm+Cm9Ata-pLN25w@mail.gmail.com> <02c05dfc-7cc4-4ec6-a331-d915e2e9cdbf@s5g2000vbj.googlegroups.com> <CAO7tK2eUJHA-35pXtbHnhusyG0ef1T6D_SrPf94RhALoYWUM3Q@mail.gmail.com> <07b7573a-45c9-44be-9d03-a74aa2b1127d@q20g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>
In-Reply-To: <07b7573a-45c9-44be-9d03-a74aa2b1127d@q20g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>
X-Original-Sender: m3o@plasmatix.com
X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com:
 209.68.5.9 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of
 m3o@plasmatix.com) smtp.mail=m3o@plasmatix.com
Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
Precedence: list
Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com
List-ID: <lojban-beginners.googlegroups.com>
X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892
List-Post: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/post?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com>
List-Help: <http://groups.google.com/support/?hl=en_US>, <mailto:lojban-beginners+help@googlegroups.com>
List-Archive: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en_US>
Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com
List-Subscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:lojban-beginners+subscribe@googlegroups.com>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners/subscribe?hl=en_US>,
 <mailto:googlegroups-manage+300742228892+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Spam_score: -0.7
X-Spam_score_int: -6
X-Spam_bar: /
Content-Length: 1463

Am 06.09.2012 21:39, schrieb ianek:
>> If you restrict "simxu" to the cliques of graph theory, you can't use
>> it for something like:
>>
>> lo zajba pu simxu lo ka ce'u ce'u sanli kei gi'e se morna lo remna pramide
>> "The gymnasts stood on one another's shoulders and formed a human pyramid."
> So what {simxu} really means? That the graph is connected? Arguments
> based on something that sounds good in a natural language are
> suspicious for me. The definitions of Lojban words are (in most cases)
> in a natural language, but it doesn't mean that they should be
> ambiguous.

It's not ambiguous. The individuals in simxu1 do simxu2 to each other. 
The only difference is that instead of saying "the members of set x1 
reciprocally (do) x2" you have the individuals in simxu1 do it directly. 
There is really no use for sets in such cases, it's just a waste of time 
and makes things unnecessarily inconvenient.

mu'o mi'e la selpa'i

-- 
.i pau mi me ma .i pa mai ko mi jungau la'e di'u
.i ba bo mi va'o lo nu nelci lo nu me ma kau cu barkla
.i va'o lo nu na nelci cu denpa ti lo nu mi drata

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en.