Received: from mail-gg0-f189.google.com ([209.85.161.189]:49388) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1Tc4BB-0005TA-Gg; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:15 -0800 Received: by mail-gg0-f189.google.com with SMTP id q1sf4491342ggm.16 for ; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to:references :subject:mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence :mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=0vjhGBG73K3v+nbHE3kmFFWJ1l7GvMpjdFoRA3lp6+U=; b=ydwyQu6Hq0+NcmaNQQijvMkUCN1BX8Qx1IuUpDrd32mGdJbBUJCvY9STz8bHP4vwsQ 69gaALixGI+uALeBMAvYsfShcx4loUP3P92HAek38Nz64NEox+t0/SbDc9oFY6y6TcJ2 9JROJonYlQQCoLDKw7bBynsm/uS3vb9M3JNzV7rU+6lDZmXm370WkDwRggnP5voJydCY yVkqKaYJV2DVxz0uLxuxhYLT/wLi8ElhFoRuNq7RakaT3Vq2GSDm2UMbFd117tE15F8J nRqeqXpO877r09gya4o7kOl8MaOFZkBwwx+mIhIV+8VDatuU1CrpEH9SiPCLTNCceoAY XjlA== Received: by 10.49.116.115 with SMTP id jv19mr515893qeb.21.1353719103027; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:03 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.130.97 with SMTP id od1ls588282qeb.86.gmail; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.84.167 with SMTP id a7mr849344qez.11.1353719102617; Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:02 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:05:02 -0800 (PST) From: mudri To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Cc: park.annie@asb.gaggle.net Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <86998A6C-7519-43EF-A477-80F8027CE9A9@asb.gaggle.net> References: <461d8410-7da9-44ca-8714-33965aaf93ca@googlegroups.com> <86998A6C-7519-43EF-A477-80F8027CE9A9@asb.gaggle.net> Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Question MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: jammyatjammy@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_1879_28565210.1353719102298" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / Content-Length: 11803 ------=_Part_1879_28565210.1353719102298 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Specifically, non-terminal symbols are written in all-capitals. This may make things clearer: http://epaperpress.com/lexandyacc/thy.html (though it may not). On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:55:33 UTC, Annie wrote: > > Oh, so you're saying I'm over my head right? What kind of basic > conventions? > > Sent from my iPod > > On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:37 PM, mudri > > wrote: > > Basically, so that it can be used in YACC. To appreciate that answer > fully, you'd need to know some basic conventions used in context-free > grammar notation. > On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:30:33 UTC, Annie wrote: >> >> Since it's not really a letter, why would you want to capitalize the >> apostrophe? >> >> Sent from my iPod >> >> On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:20 PM, mudri wrote: >> >> The curly braces are quotes for Lojban text within text of other >> languages. I'm not quite sure why they're used, but it's a kind of standard. >> >> For upper case apostrophe, I'll give the example of the name of selma'o >> {KOhA} (again, braces are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}. So, as 'K' >> is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe. >> >> On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:14:36 UTC, Annie wrote: >>> >>> Are you saying that left-brace is sort of a letter? What do you mean by >>> upper apostrophe, or whatever? >>> >>> Sent from my iPod >>> >>> On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri wrote: >>> >>> Just to add something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostrophe >>> (both called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, >>> though it is very common in these. >>> >>> It is called a "half letter" sometimes for various reasons. Matt >>> explained how it only appears between vowels, and is unique in this respect >>> (commas, if I remember correctly, can be used next to syllabic consonants - >>> but that's unimportant). The apostrophe also has no effect on morphology: >>> CVV and CV'V syllables behave identically (other than having different >>> meanings). Finally, it is counted almost literally as half a letter in the >>> lujvo scoring algorithm. "Something that acts as half a letter", I suppose >>> someone thought, "should have 'half' a glyph, pe'a". >>> >>> On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie wrote: >>>> >>>> I found out that in Lojban, there's apparently no h. How is that so, >>>> when the apostrophe is practically the h? >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPod >>>> >>>> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/-zJpIwnUk9EJ. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. >>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >>> lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit this group at >>> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/QtRV2fHf8cMJ. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com > . > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. > > > > > > > *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/v1U7EQY9ay8J. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=en. ------=_Part_1879_28565210.1353719102298 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Specifically, non-terminal symbols are written in all-capitals. This may ma= ke things clearer: http://epaperpress.com/lexandyacc/thy.html (though it may not)= .

On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:55:33 UTC, Annie wrote:
Oh, so you're sa= ying I'm over my head right? What kind of basic conventions?

Sent fr= om my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:37 PM, mudri <jammy= a...@gmail.com> wrote:

B= asically, so that it can be used in YACC. To appreciate that answer fully, = you'd need to know some basic conventions used in context-free grammar nota= tion.
On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:30:33 UTC, Annie wrote:
Since it's not really= a letter, why would you want to capitalize the apostrophe?

Sent fro= m my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 6:20 PM, mudri <jammya...= @gmail.com> wrote:

The c= urly braces are quotes for Lojban text within text of other languages. I'm = not quite sure why they're used, but it's a kind of standard.

For upper case apostrophe, I'll give the example of the name of selma= 'o {KOhA} (again, braces are "quotes"). It is derrived from {ko'a}. So, as = 'K' is capital 'k', 'h' is capital apostrophe.

On Saturday, 24 Novem= ber 2012 00:14:36 UTC, Annie wrote:
Are you saying that left-brace is sort of a letter?= What do you mean by upper apostrophe, or whatever? 

Sen= t from my iPod

On Nov 23, 2012, at 5:19 PM, mudri <jamm= ya...@gmail.com> wrote:

= Just to add something, 'h' is the upper case version of the apostrophe (bot= h called {.y'y.}). This really only ever occurs in selma'o names, though it= is very common in these.

It is called a "half letter" s= ometimes for various reasons. Matt explained how it only appears between vo= wels, and is unique in this respect (commas, if I remember correctly, can b= e used next to syllabic consonants - but that's unimportant). The apostroph= e also has no effect on morphology: CVV and CV'V syllables behave identical= ly (other than having different meanings). Finally, it is counted almost li= terally as half a letter in the lujvo scoring algorithm. "Something that ac= ts as half a letter", I suppose someone thought, "should have 'half' a glyp= h, pe'a".

On Sunday, 18 November 2012 22:50:10 UTC, Annie wrote:I found out that in Lojban, there's ap= parently no h. How is that so, when the apostrophe is practically the h?

Sent from my iPod

*** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/-zJpIwnUk9EJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@goo= glegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= wbr>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.





*** This Email was sent by a s= tudent at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/9XOwVTG6NqEJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@goo= glegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= wbr>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.





*** This Email was sent by a s= tudent at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.= google.com/d/msg/lojban-beginners/-/QtRV2fHf8cMJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.co= m.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/<= wbr>group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.





*** This Email was sent by a s= tudent at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/l= ojban-beginners/-/v1U7EQY9ay8J.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
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