Received: from mail-vc0-f189.google.com ([209.85.220.189]:46379) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.76) (envelope-from ) id 1TcNn3-0004Is-OT; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:38 -0800 Received: by mail-vc0-f189.google.com with SMTP id p16sf2441584vcq.16 for ; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:27 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=x-beenthere:date:from:to:cc:message-id:in-reply-to:references :subject:mime-version:x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence :mailing-list:list-id:x-google-group-id:list-post:list-help :list-archive:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=Jkb6oC/qMlK/zIwTywY3eCX/xMc/IEjGBn84GJHW/wo=; b=wU9w+MiEPZF94oZSkfT9i3U0UC3W0P+xpPOLqtRsTvZV4kSjAiZc8hoIumYnmjG/BR 9+GqGER3IR2N7cbTy8Q2nrTB6l+mcycuR6bW1a5mmDPnJxQXuAOic7d5doFuM2Bz0CR/ tYq5NyVtp4Ol6Ws7LKeRSZCQolhjI6+cfPVpUhkJXU6MozE7T1nCh7JZInVCGiBVki0s W+Ew5kFuIxEivXvzMPdhF1YX3cXiENzurGralBmzGJvHwg0kCWnplKu/YjlGhLy8Cdq1 IWMPoiPFXlZzMH2iMHTkL1QqPgVrH4PtAeRLMrUpNFMaWKXPPDjy1i4tKs9rmtOjWt9d zqJQ== Received: by 10.49.116.115 with SMTP id jv19mr1109961qeb.21.1353794487408; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:27 -0800 (PST) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.49.37.105 with SMTP id x9ls956436qej.56.gmail; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.49.24.13 with SMTP id q13mr1475255qef.33.1353794486398; Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2012 14:01:26 -0800 (PST) From: mudri To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Cc: park.annie@asb.gaggle.net Message-Id: <4a31189b-34c9-4b17-9744-eaeda02a0cb9@googlegroups.com> In-Reply-To: References: <41C793FE-DF9E-4814-82D9-353E740E390D@asb.gaggle.net> <0008395A-7118-4574-819E-2C5EDB2ED45F@asb.gaggle.net> <9027430.VGYknXV5XY@caracal> Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] Fullstop MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Original-Sender: jammyatjammy@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: Sender: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_Part_562_22577632.1353794486101" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Spam_score: 0.0 X-Spam_score_int: 0 X-Spam_bar: / Content-Length: 7150 ------=_Part_562_22577632.1353794486101 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Because we can. Seriously, spaces are often* unneeded, and running cmavo together into=20 "cmavo clusters" can be clearer. A good example is with numbers, where I'd= =20 prefer to say {li pano} =3D "the-number 10", rather than {li pa no} (which = is=20 like writing "the-number 1 0"). Cmavo clusters are easy to split up; each= =20 cmavo starts with a consonant (other than apostrophe, but including full=20 stop), which is followed by vowels, and maybe an apostrophe. *(Not important:) If stress is marked (as it is in speech), no spaces are= =20 needed. Stress/spaces are needed to distinguish between {rodbo'e bai ko'a}= =20 and {rodbo'ebai ko'a}. Written with no spaces, they are {rodb=F3'ebaik=F3'a= }=20 and {rodbo'=E9baik=F3'a}, respectively. On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:48:06 UTC, Annie wrote: > > Why would you want to elide two words together like that, when you can=20 > just space between them?=20 > > Sent from my iPod=20 > > On Nov 21, 2012, at 10:51 PM, Pierre Abbat >=20 > wrote:=20 > > > On Wednesday, November 21, 2012 13:18:39 Annie wrote:=20 > >> All that makes since, the full stop separating one word from a word=20 > that=20 > >> begins a vowel and all. However, I've seen it in the middle of words= =20 > >> before. What's that for? Sent from my iPod=20 > >=20 > > It's actually separating two words, but they're written run together.= =20 > For=20 > > example:=20 > >=20 > > la .kot.divu=E1r. na.e la .pyd. xazdo=20 > > C=F4te d'Ivoire not-and Tibet Asian=20 > > C=F4te d'Ivoire is not Asian, but Tibet is.=20 > >=20 > > "kot.divuar" is two words, but a single name. "na.e" is two words, but = a=20 > > single conjunction, and the second word begins with a vowel. ("naje" is= =20 > also=20 > > two words, and logically the same conjunction, but it connects a=20 > different kind=20 > > of phrase.)=20 > >=20 > > ta'e la .kot.divu=E1r. du la xantyde'i xaskoi=20 > >=20 > > Pierre=20 > > --=20 > > li ze te'a ci vu'u ci bi'e te'a mu du=20 > > li ci su'i ze te'a mu bi'e vu'u ci=20 > >=20 > > --=20 > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google=20 > Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.=20 > > To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.com.=20 > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to=20 > lojban-beginne...@googlegroups.com .=20 > > For more options, visit this group at=20 > http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > > *** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.=20 > --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lo= jban-beginners/-/5nnPbNHIMfcJ. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den. ------=_Part_562_22577632.1353794486101 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Because we can.

Seriously, spaces are often* unneeded, a= nd running cmavo together into "cmavo clusters" can be clearer. A good exam= ple is with numbers, where I'd prefer to say {li pano} =3D "the-number 10",= rather than {li pa no} (which is like writing "the-number 1 0"). Cmavo clu= sters are easy to split up; each cmavo starts with a consonant (other than = apostrophe, but including full stop), which is followed by vowels, and mayb= e an apostrophe.

*(Not important:) If stress is ma= rked (as it is in speech), no spaces are needed. Stress/spaces are needed t= o distinguish between {rodbo'e bai ko'a} and {rodbo'ebai ko'a}. Written wit= h no spaces, they are {rodb=F3'ebaik=F3'a} and {rodbo'=E9baik=F3'= a}, respectively.

On Saturday, 24 November 2012 00:48:06 UTC,= Annie wrote:
Why would you wa= nt to elide two words together like that, when you can just space between t= hem?

Sent from my iPod

On Nov 21, 2012, at 10:51 PM, Pierre Abbat <ph...@bezitopo.org= > wrote:

> On Wednesday, November 21, 2012 13:18:39 Annie wrote:
>> All that makes since, the full stop separating one word from a= word that
>> begins a vowel and all. However, I've seen it in the middle of= words
>> before. What's that for? Sent from my iPod
>=20
> It's actually separating two words, but they're written run togeth= er. For=20
> example:
>=20
> la .kot.divu=E1r. na.e la .pyd. xazdo
> C=F4te d'Ivoire not-and Tibet Asian
> C=F4te d'Ivoire is not Asian, but Tibet is.
>=20
> "kot.divuar" is two words, but a single name. "na.e" is two words,= but a=20
> single conjunction, and the second word begins with a vowel. ("naj= e" is also=20
> two words, and logically the same conjunction, but it connects a d= ifferent kind=20
> of phrase.)
>=20
> ta'e la .kot.divu=E1r. du la xantyde'i xaskoi
>=20
> Pierre
> --=20
> li ze te'a ci vu'u ci bi'e te'a mu du
> li ci su'i ze te'a mu bi'e vu'u ci
>=20
> --=20
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google= Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroup= s.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne= ...@googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.goo= gle.com/group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den.
>=20
>=20


*** This Email was sent by a student at School for the Blind.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= Lojban Beginners" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/l= ojban-beginners/-/5nnPbNHIMfcJ.
=20 To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@= googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= -beginners?hl=3Den.
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