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Subject: [lojban-beginners] Re: Why no "about" brivla?
From: ianek <janek37@gmail.com>
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"danlu" means "x1 is an animal of species x2". I meant that the set of
cats is a subset of the set of all animals. Is vlasisku not usable by
blind people? I suppose so. vlasisku.lojban.org

mu'o mi'e ianek

On 2 Gru, 18:22, Annie <park.an...@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:
> What is danlu? How can mlatu be a subset of anything? I honestly think th=
e whole thing is crazy.
>
> Sent from my iPod
>
> On Dec 2, 2012, at 10:14 AM, ianek <jane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2 Gru, 14:02, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 2:48 AM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.n...@gmail.com> =
wrote:
> >>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:32:48 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 1:03 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wro=
te:
>
> >>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:15:01 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 12:00 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com>w=
rote:
>
> >>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:50:42 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com=
>wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wro=
te:
>
> >>>>>>>>>> On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
>
> >>>>>>>>>>> An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika=
2, for
> >>>>>>>>>>> instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be =
-- a
> >>>>>>>>>>> work
> >>>>>>>>>>> of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibl=
y many
> >>>>>>>>>>> other things). Consider:
>
> >>>>>>>>>>> la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
>
> >>>>>>>>>>> This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a =
girl
> >>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>> it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
>
> >>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could pos=
sibly
> >>>>>>>>>> mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
>
> >>>>>>>>> Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/s=
rana}
> >>>>>>>>> but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.
>
> >>>>>>>>> *srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is
> >>>>>>>>> related/associated with/is about x2.*
> >>>>>>>>> *ckini =A0x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relati=
onship
> >>>>>>>>> x3.*
>
> >>>>>>>>> If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
> >>>>>>>>> * =A0srana x1 is relevant to x2
> >>>>>>>>> =A0 ckini =A0x1 is relevant to x2
> >>>>>>>>> *
> >>>>>>>>> which is nonsense.
>
> >>>>>>>> ckini wouldn't be that. For one thing, you left out the x3, and =
for
> >>>>>>>> another, it isn't "relevant", it's "related". The Cold War isn't=
 relevant
> >>>>>>>> to WWII, but it is related (by being a direct result of it).
>
> >>>>>>> Sorry, it should be
> >>>>>>> * =A0srana x1 is releted to x2*
> >>>>>>> * =A0ckini =A0x1 is related to x2 by relationship x3*
>
> >>>>>> Well, by that definition, srana is {ckini fi zi'o}, which makes th=
em
> >>>>>> synonyms in the same way that litru is to klama (litru =3D {klama =
zi'o zi'o}).
>
> >>>>> Haven't you read my previous post? I mean that choosing words from =
full
> >>>>> definitions ARBITRARILY can lead to this result which is nonsense.
> >>>>> ju'o it's all bad glossing.
> >>>>> I suggest that srana refers to topic and ckini means "to be associa=
ted
> >>>>> with".
> >>>>> to dedicate is {finfriti}, {tecu'u} etc.
>
> >>>> No, ko'a srana ko'e means that ko'a is relevant to ko'e, i.e. ko'a h=
as
> >>>> something to do with ko'e.
>
> >>>> While it is true that the topic of something is pertinent, something
> >>>> which is pertinent is not necessarily the topic.
>
> >>> Then what is your opinion about my first post? Is it true that "topic=
"
> >>> brivla has right to exist on it's own?
>
> >> My opinion is that sera'a serves the purpose. As I said, "that which i=
s
> >> pertinent to A" is a superset of "the topic of A".
>
> > So what? By analogy: why would we have {mlatu} when it's clearly a
> > subset of {danlu}, so danlu serves the purpose of "x1 is a cat"?
>
> > mu'o mi'e ianek
>
> >>> Roosevelt is pertinent to the Great Depression, but he is most certai=
nly
> >>>> /not/ the topic of it.
>
> >>>>> =A0(Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing a=
s
> >>>>>> whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For exam=
ple,
> >>>>>> {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or
> >>>>>> destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters shou=
ld use
> >>>>>> zo'e instead.)
>
> >>>>> I think the CLL says almost the same.
>
> >>>>>>>>> If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is
> >>>>>>>>> relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>
> >>>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo=
'o
> >>>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
> >>>>>> =A0--
> >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> >>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group.
> >>>>> To view this discussion on the web visithttps://groups.google.com/d=
/**
> >>>>> msg/lojban-beginners/-/**UZopTp21hiIJ<https://groups.google.com/d/m=
sg/lojban-beginners/-/UZopTp21hiIJ>
> >>>>> .
>
> >>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-b...@googlegroups.**com=
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> >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban-beginne...@**
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> >>>>> group/lojban-beginners?hl=3Den<http://groups.google.com/group/lojba=
n-beginners?hl=3Den>
> >>>>> .
>
> >>>> --
> >>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>
> >>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
> >>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
> >>>> =A0--
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>
> >> --
> >> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>
> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
> >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
> > --
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