Received: from mail-yh0-f56.google.com ([209.85.213.56]:48804) by stodi.digitalkingdom.org with esmtps (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.80.1) (envelope-from ) id 1XRjHD-00012p-4B for lojban-beginners-archive@lojban.org; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:45 -0700 Received: by mail-yh0-f56.google.com with SMTP id z6sf1378315yhz.1 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=20120806; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-sender:x-original-authentication-results:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type; bh=7t5P+djr/pPniohzzjjhLfczWCQvL5Jxw0EYzHw+eIk=; b=zAi+xnogPEmgPwb9xUiLYPC77EmDYjo3hPV0h4GvBfFmQ81QocoohVjozkJhYrfh+M TG2dwc2A6wQ9+hUacAin2l0KFD+V2ltoUnuRQFmwIkwHyTXtsTo1O+6TpRD0w+IF3z9k WlRD6TWT/TIIkphoBckoj4IgHxSrQZEGTjTuHvscGTZZRXFN7Qptv5DBy2woTYerZX5s kf8fJhNMC3XVTzFiRgpMV9LINc5w3JEh7BFxf8IHB7Jg9ORGDAmeopImrsOprQ60rF4Y nM3H0rUDsuo9YXmImvZnoUZD1t4eZNKx771AXgWgM+1ecKKjJnmxgCX9Rn3NoA041Jxn qwig== X-Received: by 10.50.50.205 with SMTP id e13mr495627igo.17.1410360816583; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:36 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.50.23.108 with SMTP id l12ls3215417igf.2.canary; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.50.92.104 with SMTP id cl8mr850685igb.1.1410360815657; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-qg0-x231.google.com (mail-qg0-x231.google.com [2607:f8b0:400d:c04::231]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTPS id k7si3186389qcm.2.2014.09.10.07.53.35 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:400d:c04::231 as permitted sender) client-ip=2607:f8b0:400d:c04::231; Received: by mail-qg0-f49.google.com with SMTP id j5so5831474qga.22 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.140.49.71 with SMTP id p65mr61591732qga.54.1410360815503; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.96.50.167 with HTTP; Wed, 10 Sep 2014 07:53:35 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <2845747.BXNi2yFm3g@caracal> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 2014 08:53:35 -0600 Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban-beginners] ma xe fanva zoigy.Dial 911.gy. From: Jonathan Jones To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com X-Original-Sender: eyeonus@gmail.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of eyeonus@gmail.com designates 2607:f8b0:400d:c04::231 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=eyeonus@gmail.com; dkim=pass header.i=@gmail.com; dmarc=pass (p=NONE dis=NONE) header.from=gmail.com Reply-To: lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com; contact lojban-beginners+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: X-Google-Group-Id: 300742228892 List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11351c3669d42a0502b7379c X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_bar: - Content-Length: 17278 --001a11351c3669d42a0502b7379c Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 .ienai On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 8:10 AM, Gleki Arxokuna wrote: > zo ra enai zo ri > > 2014-09-10 18:08 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Jones : > >> On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 7:56 AM, Gleki Arxokuna < >> gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> ko jorne la'e li 911 >>> >> >> .i na nelci lonu do pilno zo jorne la'edi'u .iku'i radji'i.ei lodu'u ri >> mapti >> >> >>> i zo aktygau cu su'oroi mapti >>> >>> 2014-09-10 17:51 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Jones : >>> >>>> On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 7:38 AM, Gleki Arxokuna < >>>> gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> jorne >>>>> >>>> >>>> ??? >>>> >>>> >>>>> 2014-09-10 17:36 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Jones : >>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 6:49 AM, Pierre Abbat >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> The missing concept includes opening a file, accessing a webpage, >>>>>>> opening a >>>>>>> cupboard, opening a book, or accessing a memory location. Opening a >>>>>>> cupboard >>>>>>> is "kargau", but that's what you do to the door; I'm talking about >>>>>>> what you do >>>>>>> to the cupboard. Any suggestions? >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I can't think of anything better than that, honestly. Is there any >>>>>> language which uses a word that means something other than "open"? Can you >>>>>> express the concept you're talking about in any language that you know, in >>>>>> a dictionary definition way, as opposed to the list of examples you gave? >>>>>> >>>>>> Going way off the deep end, the act of opening a, say, cardboard box >>>>>> is basically transforming a hollow, convex cube into a concave... >>>>>> hexahedron?... for the purposes of gaining access to what was the interior, >>>>>> but that seems to me just a very esoteric and wordy way to convey the exact >>>>>> same thing "opening a box". >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>>>>> >>>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>> lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com >>>>> . >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >>>> >>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> mu'o mi'e .aionys. >> >> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o >> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Lojban Beginners" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Lojban Beginners" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- mu'o mi'e .aionys. .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D ) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Lojban Beginners" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. --001a11351c3669d42a0502b7379c Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
.ienai


On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 8:10 AM, Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
zo ra enai zo ri
=

2014-09-10 18:08 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>:
On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 7:56 AM, Gl= eki Arxokuna <gleki.is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
ko jorne la'e li 911

.i na nelci lonu do pilno zo jo= rne la'edi'u .iku'i radji'i.ei lodu'u ri mapti
=A0
i zo aktygau cu su'oroi mapti

2014-09-10 17:51 GMT+04= :00 Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com>:
On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 7:38 AM, Gleki Arxokuna <gleki.= is.my.name@gmail.com> wrote:
jorne

???
=A0
2014-09-10 17:36 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Jones <eyeonus= @gmail.com>:
On Wed, Sep 10, 2014 at 6:49 AM, Pierre Abbat &= lt;phma@bezitopo.org= > wrote:
The missing concept includes opening a file, accessing a webpage, opening a=
cupboard, opening a book, or accessing a memory location. Opening a cupboar= d
is "kargau", but that's what you do to the door; I'm talk= ing about what you do
to the cupboard. Any suggestions?
=A0
I can't think of anything better than that, honestly. Is there any la= nguage which uses a word that means something other than "open"? = Can you express the concept you're talking about in any language that y= ou know, in a dictionary definition way, as opposed to the list of examples= you gave?

Going way off the deep e= nd, the act of opening a, say, cardboard box is basically transforming a ho= llow, convex cube into a concave... hexahedron?... for the purposes of gain= ing access to what was the interior, but that seems to me just a very esote= ric and wordy way to convey the exact same thing "opening a box".=
<= font color=3D"#888888">

--
mu'o mi= 9;e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk.= mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D = )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


=
--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo piln= o be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Lu= ke, I am your father. :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.


=
--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo piln= o be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Lu= ke, I am your father. :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lojban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.=
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.



--
mu'o mi= 'e .aionys.

.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.l= uk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. = :D )

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;Lojban Beginners" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to lo= jban-beginners+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to lojban-beginners@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban-beginners.
For more options, visit http= s://groups.google.com/d/optout.
--001a11351c3669d42a0502b7379c--