[lojban-beginners] Re: A question about gismu definitions

[Minimiscience <minimiscience@gmail.com>]

de'i li 18 pi'e 12 pi'e 2009 la'o fy. Christopher Doty .fy. cusku zoi
skamyxatra.
> I was just looking though the jbovlaste, and it looks like definitions
> get proposed and voted on by the community?  Maybe this is why the
> definitions seem a bit weird to me...  I had previously thought that,
> as with the grammar and gismu themselves, they were a sort of
> pre-defined set and not so flexible. Am I understanding this process
> right? Namely, that I should be flexible in understanding the
> definitions because they come from different people, and aren't writ
> in stone?
.skamyxatra

Jbovlaste only lets people submit & vote on definitions for {lujvo} and
{fu'ivla} (and {cmene}, I guess, but I don't know whether there are any in
Jbovlaste or not).  NO ONE is allowed to touch the {gismu} definitions (not
even blatantly wrong bits like the keyword of "{jegvo}"), and only the BPFK may
deal with the {cmavo} definitions, which they are still working on, and they
will not be changed in Jbovlaste until they're finished.  The official (i.e.,
English-language) {gismu} & {cmavo} definitions were written by a committee
years ago and are kept frozen in order to preserve the stability of the
language.

> Which brings me to another question:
> 
> cpina	 - x1 is pungent/piquant/peppery/spicy/irritating to sense x2
> 
> It seems odd to me to have "irritating" in this definition, since it
> presumes that something spicy or peppery is bad.  Wouldn't this sort
> of opinion about good or bad be better done with attitudinals?

I believe that the primary connotation of "{cpina}" is "pungent" (that being
the keyword and the first definition, after all), and hence the focus is on
things that overwhelm the senses with a sharp sensation.  Peppery & spicy
things are typical examples of "{cpina}," and an overwhelming sensation is
often irritating, hence the reference to both concepts.  Keep in mind that the
{gismu} always represent broad, general concepts; specifics are left to {lujvo}
and {fu'ivla}.

> .ii le cidja cpina
> 'Yikes, the food is spicy!'
> 
> .ui le cidja cpina
> 'Yay, the food is spicy!'
> 
> With irritating in this definition, the last one seems to be more like
> "I'm happy that this food is irritating," which seems an odd thing to
> say..
> 
> Am I missing something here?

Yes, you're missing a "{cu}" in front of the "{cpina}."

mu'omi'e .kamymecraijun.

-- 
ko kutygau le do skami jbipru bo vreji