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Re: [lojban-beginners] Re: Why no "about" brivla?
What is danlu? How can mlatu be a subset of anything? I honestly think the whole thing is crazy.
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On Dec 2, 2012, at 10:14 AM, ianek <janek37@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> On 2 Gru, 14:02, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 2:48 AM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.n...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:32:48 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>>
>>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 1:03 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:15:01 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 12:00 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:50:42 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
>>>>>>>>>>> instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a
>>>>>>>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>>> of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
>>>>>>>>>>> other things). Consider:
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
>>
>>>>>>>>>>> This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly
>>>>>>>>>> mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
>>
>>>>>>>>> Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/srana}
>>>>>>>>> but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.
>>
>>>>>>>>> *srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is
>>>>>>>>> related/associated with/is about x2.*
>>>>>>>>> *ckini x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relationship
>>>>>>>>> x3.*
>>
>>>>>>>>> If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
>>>>>>>>> * srana x1 is relevant to x2
>>>>>>>>> ckini x1 is relevant to x2
>>>>>>>>> *
>>>>>>>>> which is nonsense.
>>
>>>>>>>> ckini wouldn't be that. For one thing, you left out the x3, and for
>>>>>>>> another, it isn't "relevant", it's "related". The Cold War isn't relevant
>>>>>>>> to WWII, but it is related (by being a direct result of it).
>>
>>>>>>> Sorry, it should be
>>>>>>> * srana x1 is releted to x2*
>>>>>>> * ckini x1 is related to x2 by relationship x3*
>>
>>>>>> Well, by that definition, srana is {ckini fi zi'o}, which makes them
>>>>>> synonyms in the same way that litru is to klama (litru = {klama zi'o zi'o}).
>>
>>>>> Haven't you read my previous post? I mean that choosing words from full
>>>>> definitions ARBITRARILY can lead to this result which is nonsense.
>>>>> ju'o it's all bad glossing.
>>>>> I suggest that srana refers to topic and ckini means "to be associated
>>>>> with".
>>>>> to dedicate is {finfriti}, {tecu'u} etc.
>>
>>>> No, ko'a srana ko'e means that ko'a is relevant to ko'e, i.e. ko'a has
>>>> something to do with ko'e.
>>
>>>> While it is true that the topic of something is pertinent, something
>>>> which is pertinent is not necessarily the topic.
>>
>>> Then what is your opinion about my first post? Is it true that "topic"
>>> brivla has right to exist on it's own?
>>
>> My opinion is that sera'a serves the purpose. As I said, "that which is
>> pertinent to A" is a superset of "the topic of A".
>
> So what? By analogy: why would we have {mlatu} when it's clearly a
> subset of {danlu}, so danlu serves the purpose of "x1 is a cat"?
>
> mu'o mi'e ianek
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Roosevelt is pertinent to the Great Depression, but he is most certainly
>>>> /not/ the topic of it.
>>
>>>>> (Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as
>>>>>> whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example,
>>>>>> {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or
>>>>>> destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use
>>>>>> zo'e instead.)
>>
>>>>> I think the CLL says almost the same.
>>
>>>>>>>>> If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is
>>>>>>>>> relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>>
>>>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
>>>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>>
>>>>>> --
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>>>> --
>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>>
>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>>
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>> --
>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>>
>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
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