On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 12:02 PM, Annie <park.annie@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:
in statements that include prepositions in english, do you have prepositions in lojban, or are they included in the selbri?Prepositions == bridi. The selbri is the thing which describes what relationship the preposition is about.Sent from my iPodOn Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 4:51 PM, Annie <park.annie@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:
i've looked up what a predicate is, and, to me, it sounds like the predicate is the selbri.
Yes.
therefore, how can there be such a thing as a predicate relation? isn't that a selbri relation, which doesn't make sence?
Yes, a predicate relation is a selbri relation. In Lojban, everything is expressed as a relationship.
For example, when you say {ta gerku}, you're saying "That's a dog", but to be completely literal, what you're saying is "The thing I'm pointing to over there (which is what {ta} means), has the relationship "something is a dog of species something".
The selbri, or in English the predicate, is the thing which tells you what the relationship is, while the sumti, or in English the arguments, are the things that are a part of that relationship.
Another example:
{mi xabju lo zdani}
"I live in a house."
"The thing which is me and the thing which is a house have the relationship "something lives in something", with 'me' being the first something, and 'a house' being the second something."
Sent from my iPodBasically, anything that has a place structure can be a selbri. "selbri", by the way, is a lujvo formed from "se bridi". The definition of bridi is:x1 is a predicate relationship with relation x2 among arguments x3The x2 is the relation, which is where selbri comes from: sb1=b2 is the relation of predicate relationship sb2=b1 among arguments sb3=b3 (Note: bN is the place in the def. of bridi, sbN is the place in the def. of selbri).--On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 10:11 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:Correct. In fact, even simpler: tanru.ta tcebra gerku zdani => "That is a huge dog house""tcebarda" is a lujvo, "gerku" and "zdani" are each gismu. But the whole thing "tcebarda gerku zdani" is the "selbri".--On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 12:04 AM, Alex Rozenshteyn <rpglover64@gmail.com> wrote:In that case, though, it's not the word acting as the selbri but the phrase.On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 11:06 PM, Luke Bergen <lukeabergen@gmail.com> wrote:
And in fact, by using {me}, just about anything can be coerced into acting as a selbri. e.g. mi me li ci "I am the number 3"On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 11:03 PM, .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com> wrote:
Annie, lujvo and gismu refer to properties of the words themselves, while selbri refers to how the word is used in a sentence. Because in lojban there is no hard divide (like there is in English) between, for example, words which are verbs, adjectives, adverbs, and nouns, lujvo, gismu, and even a few cmavo can be used as selbri.
--On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 10:34 PM, Annie <park.annie@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:
i may not know what i'm talking about, but the best word would definately either be selbri or attitudinal.
Sent from my iPodOn Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:37 PM, Jonathan Jones <eyeonus@gmail.com> wrote:On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 1:09 PM, .arpis. <rpglover64+jbobau@gmail.com> wrote:ju'o so'i roi retsku .i ku'i ji'a sai mi krefu retsku di'e .i fanva zo'oi should fu ma to mu'i zoi gy. I should eat .gy. joi zoi gy. I should go to the gym .gy. to mabla me zo zoi javni toi toi"I'm sure it's been asked many times before; even so, I ask it again: How does one translate "should" (e.g. "I should eat", "I should go to the gym" (Damned "zoi" rules))?
With gismu:I'm a little unsure about the proper Lojban word for what I mean here (selbri?), but it seems to me that using "gismu" is overly specific. Similar for "attitudinal" when "cmavo" would apply. Those two categories cover all the bases (since names can't do the job).stevo
mi bilga lonu citka
With attitudinal (although I wouldn't be surprised if there's disagreement on this one):
mi citka.ei
----
mu'o mi'e .arpis.
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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