Re: [lojban-beginners] merli

[David Gowers <00ai99@gmail.com>]

Hi Remo,

On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 10:14 PM, Remo Dentato <rdentato@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have a doubt on "merli" :
>
>   x_1 (agent) measures/evaluates x_2 [quantity] as x_3 units on scale
> x_4 (si'o), with accuracy x_5.
>
> My bad English is at fault here.
>
> is it "mi merli re" in the sense of "I measure (something) and I get 2
> as result"
> or is it "le karce merli re" in the sense of "the car measures 2 [meters]"

The car is almost certainly not an agent, so that is not a likely sense.
(and 2 meters is partially specified-- 2 meters long? high? wide?)

I think you meant "mi merli li re",
and "le karce ku merli li re". ('le karce merli re' is non
grammatical, but says something like "the car-ish type of measurer. 2"
-- that is, {karce} forms a tanru with {merli} because you didn't
terminate {le karce}

>
> If it's the former I would expect x_2 to be the measured object and
> not a quantity.
>
> Also I don't get x_3 at all!
>
> If it was:
>
>  x_1 (agent) measures/evaluates the object x_2 and gets as result x_3
> units on scale x_4 (si'o), with accuracy x_5.
>
> It would be much clearer to me.

Place structure is mostly based on frequency of usage (the less often
a place is used, the later the number it gets assigned.)

I'll give an example of merli usage:


{mi merli lo ni blanu}

I measure the amount of blanu x1 (being blue) -- ie. I measure
blueness. (what result I arrive at is not specified here)

{mi  merli  lo ni blanu ku  li re}

I measure the amount of blueness as 2.

I'm not 100% sure about x4, but I think it is used like this:

{mi  merli  le ni blanu ku  li re  lo si'o dugri}

I measure the amount of blueness as 2 on a logarithmic scale.

(exactly what logarithm is used is not specified. log10 is common,
though, so let's say it's log10 for the sake of this sentence.)

Now, perhaps you want to talk about how blue your car is.

{mi  merli  le le mi karce ku ni blanu ku  li re  lo si'o dugri}

I measure (the amount-of-blueness associated with (the car associated
with me)) as 2 on a logarithmic scale.

(parentheses added for clarity)

In summary:

x1 is an agent (ie. something that can act independently)

x2, as it is labelled [quantity], is usually going to be a {lo ni
SELBRI} or {le ni SELBRI}

x3 will always be a number. {li NUMBER} is the only case you'll run
into most of the time.

x4 is someone's (notion of some specific SELBRI) (si'o, from 'sidbo' gismu).
This will only be {le si'o SELBRI} or {lo si'o SELBRI}, as a rule.
I chose {lo} here because logarithms are a general idea, we are not
talking about a specific variation on a logarithmic scale.
{lo si'o dugri} == someone's idea of logarithm. (it's possible to
specify whose idea; but that is often not very relevant and is
certainly beyond the scope of this explanation.)

x5 is probably a +-  error margin or a percentage. (li so so ce'i)
-- 99% accuracy?. Anyway, in most situations you will not care about
filling this place.

HTH,

mi'e kampu

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