Re: [lojban-beginners] Knitting

[Matthew Walton <matthew@matthew-walton.co.uk>]

I am a knitter, but not much of a Lojbanist.

On 23 December 2010 20:57, Michael Turniansky <mturniansky@gmail.com> wrote:
>  I am not a knitter (or is that I am knot a nitter?), but I shall try
> to address your questions.
>
> On Thu, Dec 23, 2010 at 3:25 PM, Alex Rozenshteyn <rpglover64@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Sorry for the multiple emails in a short span of time, but when I have
>> lojban questions, they tend to come in bursts.
>>
>> {nivji} is the word for the act of knitting; e.g. {mi mo'u nivji lo
>> nivycreka} for "I finished knitting a sweater." (or will finish, or once
>> long ago finished, etc.)
>>
>> But what word describes a knitting needle?  Is it a {nivji jesni}?  In
>> Russian, there is a unique root for "knitting needle" that has nothing to do
>> with "needle" (although crocheting is "knitting with a hook")?
>>
>  If you don't want to use nivji jesni (nivjesni), I don't think
> anyone would have a hard time understanding nivji tutci (nivytci) or
> even nivji grana (nivga'a)

All three of those are doable, although I think {nivji tutci} could be
rather broader than just the knitting needles, and cover all the other
kinds of tool used for knitting too.

>> How should "Right side" and "Wrong side" be described?  Right side refers to
>> the side of the material that is intended to be seen when the {selnivji} is
>> complete.  Wrong side refers to the side which is not intended to be seen.
>> Double-knitted projects [can be said to] have two right sides and no wrong
>> side.
>
> selvi'a sefta and tolselvi'a sefta, it would seem to me.

They seem plausible - it's certainly an accurate description of the
role of the two sides of the fabric. The alternative might be based on
{bartu}, but then again flat things don't necessarily have a {bartu}
so {selvi'a} works for me.

>> What words are used to mean "knit" and "purl" in the sense of the two
>> stitches?  In Russian they're called (loosely translated, of course) "face
>> side thingy" and "wrong side thingy"
>>
>
> Here my ignorance of knitting will fail me, but what do you thing of
> cranivji and rixnivji?

As in, "x1 knits" and "x1 purls", I assume. I like the idea of looking
at them as either forward and backward stitches, or like the Russian
basis, face side and wrong side. "Knit" and "Purl" aren't really very
descriptive by themselves, they're just convenient.

Also handily, {cranivji} and {rixnivji} start with different letters,
which is important if you're writing abbreviated pattern instructions
which I'm sure would be necessary, although I don't know how that fits
into the grammar - but English knitting instructions for a row usually
look something like:

"Row 2: k5, k2tog, p1, yo, p1, ssk, k5" (knit five, knit two together,
purl 1, yarn over, purl 1, slip-slip-knit, knit five).

Yes we'll need some more terminology for the decreases, increases and
other such things (cabling should be fairly easy to describe
actually).

>> What word should be used to describe the little loops that form over a
>> needle?  In English they're also called stitches (and so are the
>> arrangements of knit/purl that form patterns, with such names as
>> stockinette, garter, ribbing, seed/moss; granted, Russian only has a name
>> for "ribbing"), but in Russian they're called loops.
>
> clupa seems fine.

Seems plausible to me as well. Thus when you're talking about an
already-knitted purl stitch, you'd be saying {rixclupa}.

I probably shouldn't mention crochet yet... let's get knitting sorted first.

mi'e mathw

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