[lojban-beginners] vono sementu lo zu'o pa jufra

[Cortesi <dcortesi@mindspring.com>]

On Jan 16, 2007, at 2:21 AM, turnip@bcpl.net wrote:

> Finally, I have finished the first draft of the translation of "The  
> Berenstain
> Bears and the Prize Pumpkin."

I haven't read the original. Here are my notes on translating the  
first sentence.

> .ini'oni'o lu loi guzmrkukurbita goi ko'a simsa loi drata
> mivmu'e le ka go'o li'u se cusku la pafcribe goi pycy. ca le nu
> pycy .e. le ribve'a cu sisti lo nu cicyspavi'u be fi le purdi fi ko'a

.i ni'o ni'o
   "now for something completely different" (u'i)

lu
   quote
   (x1)
      loi
         those that truly are

      guzmrkukurbita
         guzme type-of what? (must be Cucurbit, Gourd family)
            melon-gourd?

      goi ko'a
         hereinafter referred to as "A"

   simsa
      is/are like

   (x2)
      loi
         those that truly are

         drata
            different from other things...

          (simsa x3, or x2 of drata? assume the latter)
          mivmu'e
            jmive+munje
            living type of universe
               ...in the biosphere

   (simsa x3, in-property)
    le
       what we'll call

          ka
            the property of...

            go'o
               the subsequent bridi
                  == "cusku"? (gourds can talk?!?)
li'u
   end quote

se cusku
   thus spoke

   la pafcribe
      Papa Bear

      goi pycy
         hereinafter referred to as "PC" (but not jypycy, u'i)

   . (pause)

ca le nu
   during the event of...

   (x1)
   pycy .e. le ribve'a cu
      PC and the one described as bear-child

   sisti
      stopped

   (x2)
      lo nu
         the actual event of

      cicyspavi'u
         cilce+spati+vimcu
         wild-plant-removal/taking
            weeding
    be
       which/from/by
          fi le purdi
             (purdi x3:) the crop
          fi ko'a
            x3 of guzme+kukurbita?

Summarizing the result of 40 minutes work:

	"Gourds are like things that are unlike living things
	because they can talk,"
	said Papa Bear as he and the bear child stopped
	weeding the crop of gourds.

Ignorance/confusions on my part:

	use of kukurbita (==cucurbit? many readers wouldn't recognize it)
	which isn't Lojban or a cmene or a quote. Special rules
        for botanical names???

	intent of {go'o} -- which seems peculiar to be placed
	in dialogue. Papa Bear ought to be referring to
	the next bridi HE WILL UTTER, which would not be
	the bridi based on {cusku}, but which also might not
	be the "next" bridi but one much further along in the
	text of the narrative.

	{fi ko'a} when guzme has no x3 and x3 of purdi already expressed

Questions of style and word choice:

	{...simsa loi drata...} (similar to things that are dissimilar) is
	the sort of contradictory phrasing that might be effective in poetry  
but
	seems labored here, and confusing. Wouldn't {cizra} work?

	{LA pafcribe} but {LE ribve'a}?

Thanks for your efforts,

Dave Cortesi