[lojban-beginners] Re: Debug my propaganda?

["Turniansky, Michael" <MICHAEL.A.TURNIANSKY@saic.com>]

> To look at this from another perspective: I have never studied German,
> but it could be true for me to say, now, "mi [su'oroi ze'eca] tadni la
> dotyban.", because it may yet happen.  Of course, it could also be
> false, because I may not.  We don't know yet, but the statement is
> still either true or untrue regardless of whether or not we know.
> You, I think, would claim that until I actually do study German, the
> statement is simply false.  This is the point at which our opinions
> diverge, I believe. 

  That is correct.  That is where we disagree.

> But consider: if this example is false, then so
> must be "mi pu'o klama le zarci" and many similar claims.

  No, at the time it is uttered, from a purely logical POV, we can't
know whether or not it is true (though it is certainly one or the other
in a non-diverging universe.  Very Goedelian.)  But from a
conversational point of view, we can take this to mean: "mi pacna le nu
pu'o klama le zarci kei [da]" or "mi prupla fi le nu pu'o klama le
zarci" in which case it is true whether or not it actually occurs.


>  And this is why I don't want to
> say that (in all of time) I study Lojban for 14 weeks, if you see my
> point. 

  Yes, I understand your point, I just (as I've said) disagree with it.
But just remember, if you have no problems asserting (assuming you are
currently an adult), "mi verba" , then you must also have no problems
saying (with unknown truth values) "mi ninmu" because you might get a
sex change in the future, or even "mi smacu" because you might meet a
wizard with an axe to grind,.  I think you will agree that in order for
conversation to have any meaning whatsoever, such existential claims
must be allowed to be evaluated in the context of facts known, and
thereby either accepted or rejected.

                           --gejyspa