Re: [lojban] Re: {le} and {lo}.

[Chris Capel <pdf23ds@gmail.com>]

On 5/19/05, John E Clifford <clifford-j@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> 
> --- Chris Capel <pdf23ds@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Now, I believe that what Opi Lauma said would
> > have been more true
> > before your revised BPFK definition of {lo},
> > right? But the BPFK has
> > revised {lo} to be a generic article instead of
> > whatever it was
> > supposed to be before. So Complete Lojban
> > Language, and Lojban for
> > Beginners, are both out of date in this
> > respect. (Particularly, I
> > think the section in LFB on lV, lVi, and lV'i
> > is particularly
> > confusing and unhelpful, especially now.)
> >
> This is not the place to get into {lo}
> discussions again.  The xorlo, even were it
> consistent, would change the way one talked about
> {lo} very little and the way one used it scarcely
> at all (but those rare cases are doozies).
> Proceed as before and, until you get into
> metaphysical discussions (and an occasional
> intensional context), you will do just fine with
> the old version (it was always generic, it just
> is we used to know what that meant).

I'm not particularly interested in discussing the intricacies of the
changes to {lo}. But I do know that they struck me as making me much
more likely to use the article, and also they particularly affect the
accuracy and usefulness of LFB 4.2[1] (especially regarding loi). So
the changes don't strike me as un-noteworthy as you would have them
be, and I think that Opi Lauma in particular seems to have been
somewhat confused by the changes. His previous[2] statement would be
accurate under the old system, as I understand. I also found it odd
that Jorge wouldn't mention the reason Opi's current understanding was
wrong--that xorlo changed the behavior of the inner quantifier of
{lo}.

Chris Capel

[1] http://ptolemy.tlg.uci.edu/~opoudjis/lojbanbrochure/lessons/less4articles.html
[2] Opi Lauma said:
> About {lo}. Is it right that {lo gerku} = {le N
> gerku}, where N is a number of all {gerku} in the
> world?

-- 
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