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Re: [lojban] Beginner phrases



In a message dated 4/13/2001 2:05:18 PM Central Daylight Time,
jay.kominek@colorado.edu writes:


> ko gasnu vorme ganlo
> shut the door

ko te ganlo le vorme

The list is ambiguous, but I am pretty sure that in
x1 (portal/passage/entrance-way) is closed/shut/not open, preventing
passage/access to x2 by x3
x3 is prevented passage or access, not the agent of the closed/shut/not
open-ness.

In a message dated 4/13/2001 1:20:52 PM Central Daylight Time,
david@shockey.com writes:

The big problem is the distinction between sumti and selbri (nouns and verbs,
as we would say in English): you don't make it, so you get long complex
selbri (verb phrases) with no objects



pe’u ko klama vi
come here




OK, maybe {ko vi klama}  is more lojbanic, but saying that can start a row.




pe’u ko dunda cukta mi
give me the book



This says "Please be a giving book about me"  You want {pe'u ko dunda le
cukta mi}, if you have a patiuclar book in mind or {pe'u ko dunda lo cukta
mi} for a book, whatever comes to hand.



ko jinru
take a bath




OK (we will not at this point get fussy about what the child is to immerse
himself in and what he is to do in it, though given a six-year-old's
jesuitical strain, {ko lumci vo'a} might be safer)



pe’u ko jgari mi
give me a hug




On the same ground, watch out for clutching and choking.




ko gasnu vorme ganlo
shut the door



This gets complex. {gasnu} object is an event description , {lenu...}, in
this case that the door (a specific one, I assume) is closed: le vorme cu
ganlo ({cu} to mark the beginning of the selbri -- or the end of the sumti).
 So the whole comes to
{ko gasnu lenu le vorme cu ganlo}  (The original said --whatever it may mean
-- "Be agent doorly shut")






xu skule pluka
was school fun?



xu le ckule cu pluka (do) (We skip over the fact that {pluka} expects an
event description in the first place, so the question is "really" aboutsome
event involving the school and so should have teh subject-rasing {tu'a}in
front of it.  don't worry about that yet)  The original is "Is it a scholarly
pleasure?"  






lumci ledo fe xance
wash your hands



ko lumci ledo xance (the {fe} would go before {ledo} but is unneeded since
the sumti is in the right place)




ko cliva klaji
get out of the street



ko cliva le klaji (seems more of an abandonment, but I can't think of a
better word)





pe’u ko zutse ledo stizu
sit in your chair



Yup.



ko smaji
be quiet



And yup again.

A really nice start!