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Re: [lojban] Re: A (rather long) discussion of {all}

>
> I've read the first chapter of McKay's, and found that the author
> confused several issues. For example, he states that Alice is not a
> shipmate on her own, when she clearly is. She is shipmate of Bryce and 
> Carol, etc. because she is in the same group as them, and not a
> shipmate of David and Erica, because they are of a different group.
>
> Two things regarding the suggestion. First, it seems that you think
> that I don't understand how it works. I think that I do understand how > it works, it's just that I disagree with it. Second, I'm not arguing > with Quine, or McKay, because sadly they don't subscribe to this list. 
> I'm arguing with you and xorxes. I expect you to be able to argue
> against my position as well as Quine or McKay would, otherwise you
> really have no business arguing for or believing in their position. > If I show you to be wrong, you'll may just end up falling back on "oh, 
> well, that doesn't mean that Quine was wrong".
>

I beg to differ -- no person can ever be his own shipmate, any more
than he can be his own sibling or classmate or anything else of that
type.


So? You can't be a kicker without a thing kicked, you can't be a
toucher without something to touch. In the same way, you can't be a
shipmate without another shipmate. However, Alice /has/ a shipmate.
McKay states

"
"Arnie, Bob and Carlos are shipmates." This is something true of the
three of them together. We cannot say "Arnie is a shipmate" except
perhaps as elliptical for something that connects Arnie to others.
(Arnie is a shipmate of someone.)
"

The problem with that is that we can say "Arnie is a shipmate".
There's no perhaps here. What we mean when we say "Arnie is a
shipmate" is that he's a shipmate of someone.

[ li'o ]
Sorry -- this is my mistake. Rereading your original, you wrote "Alice cannot be a shipmate ON her own". I misread this as "Alice cannot be a shipmate OF her own".