Re: [lojban] predict, foretell, foreknowledge, prognosis, anticipation

[Bob LeChevalier <lojbab@lojban.org>]

At 08:02 AM 12/5/03 -0800, xorxes wrote:

> How do we deal with these concepts in Lojban?
>
> The problem with lujvo based on {purci} or {balvi} is that
> they could go either way: is it the knowing that is in
> the past of the thing known, or the other way around?
> Does {purju'o} mean "x1 knows x2 about x3, which is in the
> past of the knowing" or "x1 knows x2 about x3, before it
> happens". Is it foreknowledge or knowledge of the past?
> And the same applies to {bavju'o}: is that after-knowledge,
> knowledge after the fact, or is it future-knowledge,
> knowledge of the future? We could adopt a convention,
> I suppose, or else look for something less ambiguous.

I think jvajvo would suggest purju'o (though I think that pruju'o scores 
higher)
x1p precedes x2p
x1d knows x2d ...
x1d knows x2d=x2p ... at (earlier) time/event x1p

with
x1b is after x2b
we end up with
x1d knows x2d=x1p ... at (earlier) time/event x2p
which seems quite backwards.  The knowledge, which is the focus of the 
bridi, occurs *before* the event.

Another approach would be junli'e

and a third approach would spurn the lujvo entirely, and express 
foreknowledge as "djuno ledu'u pu'o fasnu"; you are knowing the 
anticipation of the event (and anticipating the aftermath of an event 
becomes real fun).

If we had rafsi for pu'o and ba'o that would make the lujvo easier, but I 
admit that at the time we discussed rafsi, I figured that anything pu'o 
would use purci and ba'o would use balvi just as the cmavo themselves were 
derived from those words.  That was before I took jvajvo analysis seriously.

lojbab

--
lojbab                                             lojbab@lojban.org
Bob LeChevalier, Founder, The Logical Language Group
(Opinions are my own; I do not speak for the organization.)
Artificial language Loglan/Lojban:                 http://www.lojban.org