I don't have my copy of the red book handy, but the online version has no explanation for the sound IPA [u] or the lojban letter 'u', AFAICT. Is this also true in the red book? -Robin -- http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~rlpowell/ BTW, I'm male, honest. Information wants to be free. Too bad most of it is crap. --RLP