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Re: [lojban] Logical translation request
At 01:56 PM 12/24/01 +0000, Jorge Llambias wrote:
>Yes, ZAhO and TAhE and number+ROI are all grammatically identical, but
>putting ZAhO and TAhE into one selma'o wouldn't help learning at all,
>since there's a semantic distinction to be made, and any glance at the
>formal grammar would reveal that they're grammatically identical.
I still think it would be tidier to use just one name, even if
you keep them as separate groups within the selma'o for other
purposes (the way UIs and PAs for example are grouped into
different classes).
The UI and PA groupings were put in for my convenience in sorting the list
for some particular use that I've long forgotten; I never intended them to
be official.
The problem are the actual restrictions. For example, ZEhA must always
come before ZAhO/TAhE/numberROI in a tense compound. But something
like {ze'u reroi ze'i} "long-interval twice short-interval" would
be perfectly meaningful.
It's also legal, but the grammar will stick in a ku after the reroi. If it
did not, and the intervals and properties could be in any order, then there
would be an ambiguity between ze'u reroi [ku] ze'i and ze'u [ku] reroi ze'i.
Indeed, you can say "long-interval twice
three-times", but not "long-interval twice short-interval three-times".
We can only talk of the size of the total interval, not of the
sub-intervals.
My original design for the tense system allowed nesting intervals. Cowan's
redesign allows them with ku inserted between them.
Why is not ZEhA at the same level as ZAhO/TAhE/numberROI?
We are forced to learn more rules (that ZEhA always comes before
those) and we are restricted from saying something that would be
meaningful. What is the advantage of the restriction?
Strict ordering of tense components allows complex tenses with ellipsis of
unspecified components and you know what has been left out at the time it
is skipped.
lojbab
--
lojbab lojbab@lojban.org
Bob LeChevalier, President, The Logical Language Group, Inc.
2904 Beau Lane, Fairfax VA 22031-1303 USA 703-385-0273
Artificial language Loglan/Lojban: http://www.lojban.org