Re: [lojban] Dot-side and gadri (was: Essay on the future of Lojban, with a simple poll for the community.)

[John E Clifford <kali9putra@yahoo.com>]

intensional descriptions?  Is this a special kind of description or a description of a special kind of object?  If the former,  what is wanted (and how would having neutral gadri solve it); if the latter, why is this a matter for gadri rather than for the introduced bridi?  I genuinely have forgotten what this was all about, while deprecating the results (xorlo).  The McKay piece was a brilliant find and hopefully not something anyone wants to go back on.



----- Original Message ----
From: Arnt Richard Johansen <arj@nvg.org>
To: lojban@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thu, April 8, 2010 2:41:27 PM
Subject: [lojban] Dot-side and gadri (was: Essay on the future of Lojban, with  a simple poll for the community.)

On Thu, Apr 08, 2010 at 12:21:46PM -0700, John E Clifford wrote:
> 
> For newbies and oldbies with failing midterm memories (I'm pretty good on problems in Loglan in 1977), could some one review what dot whatsis is

It is a solution to a problem that has best been described in an essay by Mark Shoulson on the wiki:
http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-index.php?page=The%20Case%20Against%20LA

Basically, proficient Lojban speakers have proven unable to prevent the slip-up where the strings “la” or “doi” accidentally appear in nonce names.

We call the variant of Lojban with all cmevla delimited with pauses on both sides “dot side”, in a reference to Star Wars.

> and what (aside from 'lo') is wrong (or was) with gadris.

Well, AFAIK the only serious problem with the Lojban gadri system as described in CLL is that it did not allow for intensional descriptions, or non-distributive plurals. The majority of people who voted on the gadri section in BPFK were of the opinion that Lojban couldn't remain without any kind of expressing intensional descriptions, so “lo” was pressed into service as an article with unspecified intensionality/extensionality.

The pre-publication drafts of the book “Plural Predication” by Thomas McKay was highly influential in this solution. (http://www.amazon.com/Plural-Predication-Thomas-McKay/dp/0199278148/)

-- 
Arnt Richard Johansen                                http://arj.nvg.org/
Yxskaftbud, ge vår wczonmö iqhjälp.

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