Re: [lojban] [PROPOSAL] Comparison

[Stela Selckiku <selckiku@gmail.com>]

On Sun, Aug 21, 2011 at 6:24 AM, Remo Dentato <rdentato@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> The amount the one is "more" than the other is x3 for {citmau}, x4 for
> {bramau} and x5 for mojmau.

That's normal generally for jvajvo.  The places of the non-base parts
of the lujvo get inserted all at once, which causes the remaining
places of the base part of the lujvo to be advanced a random distance
forward.  It isn't inconsistent, but it can feel rather random in
practice.  You're not proposing a different lujvo place structure rule
generally, are you?  So I don't see what good it does to regularize
this one area of lujvo in a different way?  It's simply the eternal,
undeniably difficult problem of reducing a tree to a list.  You gotta
shove that stuff somewhere and something's gonna get split up.

> The downside of my proposal would be that jbovlaste would have to be
> fixed (not a big task, though) and some existing text would become
> incorrect (!!).

That's a serious problem.  We invented jvajvo, indeed the entire idea
of lujvo place structures being regular at all, in order to make new
lujvo easier for people to learn and understand, not just to enforce a
steady consistency so we feel orderly.  It's great to establish a
pattern and try to follow it, but going back and changing a common
word like {nelrai} is a different matter.  I wouldn't expect all -rai
lujvo for the rest of time to unswervingly follow *any* fixed pattern.

We should be humble enough to accept the lujvo of the past as they
were given, to set up some goals for the future (while accepting that
in the future we'll have probably different ideas and plans and
tactics and we'll change those goals), and to mostly focus on the new
things that we're building at the moment, to try (if it's possible) to
leave a legacy that the next generation of Lojbanists won't feel the
need to try to rearrange out from under us.

If {nelrai} isn't consistent enough for your taste, IMO the only
appropriate remedy is simply to avoid {nelrai} for the foreseeable
future, just like we ignore {dikyjvo} and {najyzme} and every other
silly thing we've made over the decades.  Why just yesterday someone
tried to reinvent {lujyjvo} with a sensible meaning, and I had to
discourage them-- not because I think the definition it was given
years ago makes the most sense, indeed I've complained about it
publicly myself, but just because it's already been done.  We're not
just building a dead language; we're building a history, literature
and culture.  Let the past have their fun.  There's plenty of other
lujvo in the sea.

mi'e la stela selckiku
mu'o

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.