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Re: [lojban] Mini-rant: mutce and traji must die.



One of the things I really like about lojban (in the abstract, not necessarily in practice) is that selbri have places which make explicit certain things which are completely implicit in other languages; one example: {rajycla} has a "by standard" place (inherited from {clani}), which makes it clear that the "standard of tallness" matters in any discussion of height, and requires a different selbri ({rajycla be zi'o}) to ignore it.

It seems to me that spoken lojban will (almost) never use more than three places, common written lojban will behave similarly, and technical or pedantic lojban will have some words (depending on context) which use more places.

{.ua ro di'u na'e se ganzu}

On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 3:18 PM, Robin Lee Powell <rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 02:12:43PM -0600, vitci'i wrote:
> On 12/16/2011 01:31 PM, Robin Lee Powell wrote:
> > These places must die!
>
> I'm kind of curious to see how far this can be taken. What would
> happen if, even in gismu, we forbade any place that can be
> replaced by a modal?

Can those places be replaced by a modal?  Which one?

I have, fwiw, considered that posibility in my head as well.  I
think that's too much of some-other-language-that-isn't-Lojban.

> Consider {cusku}.
>
> x1 (agent) expresses/says x2 (sedu'u/text/lu'e concept) for
> audience x3 via expressive medium x4.
>
> cusku1 is covered by {gau}, and cusku3 is covered by {ri'i}.
> cusku4 is covered by {xebe'i}. Though I'm stretching a bit, cusku2
> could be covered by {fi'o jufra}, leaving us with a zero-place
> gismu.

*snrk*

> I am vaguely imagining a language centered around modals rather
> than predicates, with selbri being created implicitly and nonce by
> the lists of their places. I'm not sure that this is different
> from all gismu having exactly one place.

Yeah, as I say, I've pondered that as well as a thought experiment,
but it's a different language.  Probably a much more verbose one.

-Robin

--
http://singinst.org/ :  Our last, best hope for a fantastic future.
Lojban (http://www.lojban.org/): The language in which "this parrot
is dead" is "ti poi spitaki cu morsi", but "this sentence is false"
is "na nei".   My personal page: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/rlp/

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