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[lojban] Re: Final state of cenba/zenba/etc.





On Tuesday, April 9, 2013 8:53:47 PM UTC+4, Latro wrote:

Today I wanted to say "liquid water freezes when its temperature is decreased to 273 K" and "solid water melts when its temperature is increased to 273 K" and then quickly realized that {cenba} and friends don't have a final state place. {galfi} does, but is causal, which isn't really what's desired here. It has the undesirable "concrete binxo" undertones, too. Just {co'a} here isn't good enough, either; part of the point is that its temperature was higher (resp. lower) before and was decreased (resp. increased) to cause the phase transition.

Any ideas? Also, why is the resultative/causal distinction made explicit in the notes, but only 3 of the 4 permutations of the concept have gismu?

Actually once i even suggested to robin to detach them into (causal+non-causal) * (agentive+nonagentive).
Seems that it's even necessary.
I suggest if there are any doubts of whether a gismu is agentive or not is to use it as non-agentive and optionally add {gau}/{-gau-}/{gasnu} when needed.


mi'e la latro'a mu'o

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