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Re: [lojban] the myth of monoparsing





2015-02-16 23:13 GMT+03:00 And Rosta <and.rosta@gmail.com>:
Gleki Arxokuna, On 11/02/2015 12:50:
Even in current English theory there are a lot of zero morphemes. What I'm proposing is just another zero morpheme.

This is what And agreed with me.

I'm not sure what I agreed with you. If it's that there are a lot of zero morphemes, then yes, I do agree, or at least I agree that there are syntactic nodes that don't correspond to any phonological node, and that multiple syntactic nodes can correspond to the same phonological node, so that the morphophonological structure of the sentence is only loosely homoeomorphic with the syntactic structure.

What I also agree with you on is that in both the English and Lojban examples we have a situation where one phonological form leads determinately to a set of multiple logical explicatures. But I disagree with your contention that the situations' internal workings are analogous. In the English case we have a set of ambiguous sentences, each sentence with the same phonology and different logicosyntactic form

That's how modern grammarians perceive it, not necessarily how it is indeed works internally.

I just showed that forcing operator "=" (in PEG notation) is against "Gricean's" fifth law (actually the principle of least effort) and instead a vague operator could be used instead.


; in the Lojban case we have a single unambiguous sentence, with a single phonology and a single logicosyntactic form, which is an underspecified generalization over a set of logical explicatures.

I don't understand why you keep on about an English parser. Parsers are of practical utility and of psycholinguistic significance, but what's relevant to the discussion is grammars, not parsers. There are theories that espouse the attractive idea that the grammar is a parser (e.g. Dynamic Syntax), but it's a minoritarian view.

One language can have several grammars. I think you understand that views of grammarians change over time and the same construct was analysed in a different way in different epochs. I'm not even talking about changing terminology which again shows the instability of the theory. Which is fine of course but should lead us to absolutizing them as core features of languages (in fact such absolutizing can lead us to some whorfism).


--And.


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