Subject: Re: [lojban] Siver threads among the mold

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 31 Aug 2001 16:41:25 EDT

In a message dated 8/30/2001 9:21:50 PM Central Daylight Time, 
[email-masked] writes:

> 
> 
> la djan dunli la pol le ka ce'u clani sela'u makau
> la djan dunli la pol le ni ce'u clani
> John is equal to Paul in how tall they are.
> 
> How else would you use 'dunli'?
> 

Well, lots of otehr ways, I suppose, but these examples look paradigmatic. 
What was the point of them, since I think they are fine?

<But the frica case does NOT work with ni1. It only works with ni2.>
I don't see that at all, what could be more different than that one is 5'6" 
and the other 6'5"? And, indeed, it is just that difference that makes the 
difference in the ni2 case; you just come at it a different way. In short, I 
am unconvinced that there are two uses here that have been separated yet,and 
the fact that that they are intertranslatable in a mechanical way tends to 
support this feeling. Part of the problem is, I think (as you know by now), 
is that there is a hidden relative here trying to be fit into an indirect 
question. Another part is that we have not yet completed the analysis if the 
various parts and are off on the wrong foot on one part. For example, I 
think that at this point, {ka} and {du'u} part company again, with {ka} 
giving unique values and {du'u} sets of values, but the two have gotten so 
slopped together (and {ce'u} with {kau} a bit as well) that it is not easy to 
sort out the pieces any more.

<The 1-2 contrast is the contrast between {le broda} and
{le du'u makau broda}. In English both can often be said
using the same words.>

And again, how do you know which it is in a given case, so that the theory 
you are building is built only on cases you want in?