From lojbab@lojban.org Fri Sep 14 18:28:49 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_3_2_2); 15 Sep 2001 01:28:48 -0000 Received: (qmail 7497 invoked from network); 15 Sep 2001 01:02:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by l10.egroups.com with QMQP; 15 Sep 2001 01:02:24 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO stmpy-4.cais.net) (205.252.14.74) by mta1 with SMTP; 15 Sep 2001 01:02:24 -0000 Received: from bob.lojban.org (ppp17.net-A.cais.net [205.252.61.17]) by stmpy-4.cais.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f8F12Et36727; Fri, 14 Sep 2001 21:02:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20010914203924.00da2aa0@pop.cais.com> X-Sender: vir1036@pop.cais.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2001 20:59:17 -0400 To: Subject: Re: [lojban] (from lojban-beginners) pi'e Cc: Nick NICHOLAS In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: "Bob LeChevalier (lojbab)" At 04:15 PM 9/14/01 -0700, Nick NICHOLAS wrote: > >BTW. No one has mentioned one bit of the nitty gritty of this particular > >world standard, but don't most standards insist on 24 hour clock time? Do > >the world standard organizations believe that they will get the world to > >use a 24 hour clock in everyday life? > >Lojbab, have you ever been to Europe and read the TV listings? Good Lord. No. >People don't use 24 hours in speech in Europe, but noone uses anything but >in writing. A linguist who believes that the written language should be pre-eminent in discussing its design and nature? Actually it sounds like the printed media has kowtowed to the standards and real people using real language are heeding the standards as much as the French who use "le weekend". >I find this contempt of Standards Bodies utterly incredible. And I still >think it's a libertarian thing. Calling me a libertarian is hilarious, I'm as much a standards nut as anyone. But I lost this one, and my obligation as leader is to stand up for those who won the argument. Linguistically, I'm a pragmatist. Lojban is not by prescription going to change the way people think (you are the anti-Whorfist, though, so you should be making this argument). At best it can make it possible for people to change the way they think. Right now they seem to think in 12 hour clocks (and the fact that 12 hour clocks have persisted since the Babylonians were the last to use a duodecimal multiple as a base makes it hard to imagine that this will change quickly). >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/lojban/message/8432 >There's been a revote. > >And it's affected the Lessons. You have complete editorial freedom, (he smiles). It isn't in any baseline document. But don't go telling me I don't have to read all the traffic on the list carefully if you are going to argue fait accompli on the basis of changes made when I wasn't doing so (which was the case before LogFest). lojbab -- lojbab lojbab@lojban.org Bob LeChevalier, President, The Logical Language Group, Inc. 2904 Beau Lane, Fairfax VA 22031-1303 USA 703-385-0273 Artificial language Loglan/Lojban: http://www.lojban.org