From lojbab@lojban.org Fri Sep 28 18:42:40 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojbab@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_4_1); 29 Sep 2001 01:42:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 31172 invoked from network); 29 Sep 2001 01:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by m8.onelist.org with QMQP; 29 Sep 2001 01:42:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO stmpy-4.cais.net) (205.252.14.74) by mta1 with SMTP; 29 Sep 2001 01:42:40 -0000 Received: from bob.lojban.org (dynamic244.cl8.cais.net [205.177.20.244]) by stmpy-4.cais.net (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id f8T1gc455245 for ; Fri, 28 Sep 2001 21:42:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20010928213532.00ced140@pop.cais.com> X-Sender: vir1036@pop.cais.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 21:39:28 -0400 To: "lojban" Subject: RE: [lojban] The Pleasures of goi (was: zipf computations & experimental cmavo In-Reply-To: References: <3BB37B6C.7010607@reutershealth.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed From: "Bob LeChevalier (lojbab)" At 10:54 PM 9/28/01 +0100, And Rosta wrote: >John: > > Invent Yourself wrote: > > > no'u probably works like you think goi already does: > > > > > > ko'a goi la djan. .i li'o .i la fred. no'u ko'a > > > ko'a is John. Fred is John. > > > > By no means: saying "ko'a no'u la djan." is bogus if ko'a is not > > *already* defined. The whole point of goi (and cei) is their > > defining nature. > >But you seem to be failing to recognize that ko'a, like cmene, >do not have to be defined by goi. They can get their referent >from context. > >English: It is big. >Lojban: ko'a barda > >In neither case must it or ko'a have an antecedent in previous >utterances. This may be the case in present Lojban, but when ko'a and goi were defined, ko'a was expected to always be explicitly defined with goi at first use. Other usage was *allowed* but at the risk of confusion if nonsense resulted. lojbab -- lojbab lojbab@lojban.org Bob LeChevalier, President, The Logical Language Group, Inc. 2904 Beau Lane, Fairfax VA 22031-1303 USA 703-385-0273 Artificial language Loglan/Lojban: http://www.lojban.org