Subject: Re: [lojban] broken phone

From: Rob Speer <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2001 15:06:01 -0400

On Sat, Oct 06, 2001 at 04:14:18PM +0200, G. Dyke wrote:
> Coi rodo
> 
> For those of you who participated (and those who didn't) here is the broken
> phone chain (At last ! Sorry but I was away all week and didn't expect it to
> be all over 24 hours after And received Pierre's translation). I did my
> translation trying to keep the word-order as close to the original as
> possible. I also created lujvo to replace single words and tanru for the
> others. (You may notice that I follow the model set by Don in '96 for the
> compiling of all this). I apologize for the length of this mail.

I think trying to preserve word order and the number of words actually caused
some of the confusion. For example, I think "cupped his hand for the Princess
Alison Jocelyn" would have to have been re-worded in order that it would still
make sense after the first translation.

> I don't know whether an x1 of xirli'ustizu can fill the place of a
> direction, but I decided it was close enough. Thanks, And, for complimenting
> my "saddle" lujvo. I don't care much for either "horse-seat" or
> "horse-back-seat", but as Craig pointed out, it could have been some sort of
> carriage - only by reverse engineering that I would have said {karce} does
> the lujvo become fairly unambiguous.
> cpare in this context almost warrants a zi'o in x2, pe'i it is also
> unstatisfactory for climbing up ladders and stairs.

Not really... here x2 is the side of the horse (perhaps the stirrup), and for
ladders and stairs it is the ladder or the stairs.

> [3].i ko'a gasnu lenu le xirma cu carna kei secu'u di'e
> 
> I didn't write {cargau} because I find working out place-strctures for lujvo
> rather taxing ; I wasn't sure the x2 would be the object that is turned.
> Everyone else agreed with {cargau} though.

"gau" is easy. It just puts the actor in x1 and shifts everything over a place.
I know there are other components of a lujvo which act on it in a well-defined
way; does anybody know if there is a list of them anywhere?

--
la rab.spir
noi cargau le xirma