From pycyn@aol.com Thu Oct 11 17:49:51 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: Pycyn@aol.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_0); 12 Oct 2001 00:49:51 -0000 Received: (qmail 75631 invoked from network); 12 Oct 2001 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.26) by l9.egroups.com with QMQP; 12 Oct 2001 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r05.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.101) by mta1 with SMTP; 12 Oct 2001 00:49:51 -0000 Received: from Pycyn@aol.com by imo-r05.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v31_r1.8.) id r.8f.113a3bcd (3926) for ; Thu, 11 Oct 2001 20:49:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8f.113a3bcd.28f7982b@aol.com> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2001 20:49:47 EDT Subject: Re: [lojban] "knowledge as to who saw who" readings To: lojban@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_8f.113a3bcd.28f7982b_boundary" X-Mailer: AOL 6.0 for Windows US sub 10535 From: pycyn@aol.com X-Yahoo-Profile: kaliputra --part1_8f.113a3bcd.28f7982b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/11/2001 6:11:00 PM Central Daylight Time, jjllambias@hotmail.com writes: > What if the set of answers does not include the {noda} case? > Let's say that {ma} presupposes {da}, so that {ma} expects a > positive answer only. Since I don't admit {na'i} as a member > of the set of answers, that would mean that {noda} is out. > I think this is just a contextual matter, i.e., sometimes the presupposition is that there are some cases, sometimes there is no such presupposition. I am not sure that the difference is regularly marked. So, sometimes even {da broda} is an answer, sometimes it is not -- and similarly {noda} (which would come in in one case only after {na'i}, however you work that). Might just be clarifying in an uncertain situation. --part1_8f.113a3bcd.28f7982b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/11/2001 6:11:00 PM Central Daylight Time, jjllambias@hotmail.com writes:



What if the set of answers does not include the {noda} case?
Let's say that {ma} presupposes {da}, so that {ma} expects a
positive answer only. Since I don't admit {na'i} as a member
of the set of answers, that would mean that {noda} is out.




I think this is just a contextual matter, i.e., sometimes the presupposition is that there are some cases, sometimes there is no such presupposition.  I am not sure that the difference is regularly marked.  So, sometimes even {da broda} is an answer, sometimes it is not -- and similarly {noda} (which would come in in one case only after {na'i}, however you work that).  

<It is probably the case that "who" does have existential import,
otherwise phrases like "who if anyone" would be redundant.>

Might just be clarifying in an uncertain situation.

--part1_8f.113a3bcd.28f7982b_boundary--