From gordon.dyke@bluewin.ch Sat Oct 13 04:50:39 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: gordon.dyke@bluewin.ch X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-7_4_1); 13 Oct 2001 11:50:39 -0000 Received: (qmail 97987 invoked from network); 13 Oct 2001 11:50:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.27) by 10.1.1.223 with QMQP; 13 Oct 2001 11:50:38 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mta9n.bluewin.ch) (195.186.1.215) by mta2 with SMTP; 13 Oct 2001 11:50:38 -0000 Received: from oemcomputer (213.3.40.109) by mta9n.bluewin.ch (Bluewin AG 6.0.024) id 3BBD91030063042E for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 13 Oct 2001 13:49:36 +0200 Message-ID: <001a01c153dc$f6d5c5c0$9b29ca3e@oemcomputer> To: References: <1002970050.460.84235.m12@yahoogroups.com> Subject: re : translation challenge: "If today is Monday..." Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 13:28:12 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 From: "G. Dyke" Message: 22 Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 10:08:33 +0100 From: "And Rosta" Subject: translation challenge: "If today is Monday..." >1. If today is Monday, then tomorrow is Tuesday. >[Translation should be true, regardless of when it is said.] {lenu le pavdei cu cabdei kei nibli lenu le relday cu bavlamday} >2. If today is Monday, then tomorrow is Wednesday. >[Translation should be false, regardless of when it is said.] {lenu le pavdei cu cabdei kei nibli lenu le cibday cu bavlamday} >(Examples from a talk by Jim McCawley.) >I opine that these can be lojbanned using {mu'ei} but by no other method. If my attempts break down because it isn't monday today, try ledu'u, leka. If still... try lesi'o or leli'i. otherwise, we're missing a NU. If suggesting today is monday when it isn't isn't an abstraction, I don't know what is. I don't like {mu'ei} ! (I had written a long paragraph explaining why, but I erased it 'cause much of what I said doesn't make sense - I suppose I just don't like the idea of lojban not being able to express something which is so obvious in natural language) Greg Dyke -- "I have a proposal for the international community: help us build an execution block ; then we will be able to use our stadium for playing football" *the afghani foreign minister*