From rob@twcny.rr.com Tue Oct 30 20:33:02 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: rob@twcny.rr.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_0_1); 31 Oct 2001 04:33:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 65209 invoked from network); 31 Oct 2001 04:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by 10.1.1.222 with QMQP; 31 Oct 2001 04:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mailout6.nyroc.rr.com) (24.92.226.125) by mta3 with SMTP; 31 Oct 2001 04:33:01 -0000 Received: from mail1.twcny.rr.com (mail1-1 [24.92.226.139]) by mailout6.nyroc.rr.com (8.11.6/Road Runner 1.12) with ESMTP id f9V4X1F09677 for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2001 23:33:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from riff ([24.92.246.4]) by mail1.twcny.rr.com (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-59787U250000L250000S0V35) with ESMTP id com for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2001 23:32:59 -0500 Received: from rob by riff with local (Exim 3.32 #1 (Debian)) id 15yn2x-0000Pl-00 for ; Tue, 30 Oct 2001 23:32:11 -0500 Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 23:32:11 -0500 To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] observatives & a construal of lo'e & le'e Message-ID: <20011030233211.A1582@twcny.rr.com> Reply-To: rob@twcny.rr.com References: <15d.345830a.2910abeb@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <15d.345830a.2910abeb@aol.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.20i X-Is-It-Not-Nifty: www.sluggy.com From: Rob Speer X-Yahoo-Profile: squeekybobo On Tue, Oct 30, 2001 at 08:20:43PM -0500, pycyn@aol.com wrote: > = zo'e with its normal meaning.> > > Since the normal meaning of {zo'e} (if that locution has any sense at all) is > "the obvious thing," the observative use seem perfectly normal. Context may > force the "currently observed" meaning or some other, just as it always does. Okay, I finally figured out the sides of the argument here, and am a bit surprised to find myself on pycyn's side. And: your ideas about {zo'e} seem to arise from treating the observative as a special case. Why is this necessary? -- la rab.spir noi sarji zo gumri