From arosta@uclan.ac.uk Mon Nov 12 08:32:05 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: arosta@uclan.ac.uk X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_0_1); 12 Nov 2001 16:32:05 -0000 Received: (qmail 80114 invoked from network); 12 Nov 2001 16:32:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (216.115.97.171) by m6.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Nov 2001 16:32:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO com1.uclan.ac.uk) (193.61.255.3) by mta3.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Nov 2001 16:32:04 -0000 Received: from gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk by com1.uclan.ac.uk with SMTP (Mailer); Mon, 12 Nov 2001 16:08:20 +0000 Received: from DI1-Message_Server by gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 12 Nov 2001 16:44:12 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.5.2 Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 16:44:03 +0000 To: lojban Subject: RE: [lojban] "generic Odysseys" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline From: And Rosta X-Yahoo-Profile: andjamin >>> michael helsem 11/12/01 03:55pm >>> >From: And Rosta #>"le" would mean #>"each of certain specific versions of Michael Helsem". # #le purci prenrmaiku goiko'a .i #le balvi prenrmaiklu goiko'e .i #le steci be le prenrmaiklu cu ve jmine ko'a cezo'e ce ko'e What is {jmine}? It can't be "jmive", because that has no x4. cmima? I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Oh hang on. "jmina". So: "Each of certain things specific to each of certain things that are prenrmaiklu are the result of adding together a certain yestermichael, a certain morrowmichael, etc." I still don't get it. "lo'i prenrmaiklu cu ve jmina ko'a cezo'e=20 ce ko'e" would make sense, but I don't get what the=20 "le steci be le prenrmaiklu" means. #i can't see "lo'e prenrmaiklu" being other than "le cnano befi #le prenrmaiklu" taking the latter as the set of "ko'a bi'i ko'e". Yes, well, among the various mooted interpretations of {lo'e}, one of the viable ones is the 'statistical average' interpretation. I prefer to go with an interpretation that subsumes the statistical average as just one way of conceptualizing a category as singleton. #and that really has a use with "cnano leka cerni" for example, #if someone who only sees me at the same hour every day wanted to #discuss my morning manifestation (grouchiness, just-showered #dampness)... "is normal in each of certain properties of morning" (not sure if x2 of cna= no is the property that it is normal to have, or the property that one is n= ormal relative to) -- I glork what you mean, though. So anyway, okay, your idea of lo'e is narrower than mine, but if you define a predicate meaning "is Michael Helsem", which you, yestermichael, and morrowmichael all have, I still don't get your answer to how to use that predicate to refer unambiguously to The One and Only Michael Helsem.... --And.