Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Lojban Text to Speech

From: "randl. nortmn." <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2002 08:30:21 -0500

On Thu, Jan 10, 2002 at 02:45:05AM -0800, Edward Cherlin wrote:
> On Sunday 06 January 2002 08:26 am, Candide Kemmler wrote:
[...]
> > The french "R" (don't know the scientific word for that one...)
> > could be used too, but I don't think it's very popular. And as
> > randl. nortmn. stressed they are hardly distinguishable from the
> > lojban 'x' (but then, the "xr" diphtong seems equally problematic
> > with the both the alveolar and the "french" R...)
> 
> Speak for yourself. Some of us can easily make these distinctions. 
> For one thing, French 'r' is voiced, while 
> Russian/German/Scottish/Hebrew/Yiddish/Lojban 'x's (ch, kh) are 
> unvoiced.

I believe the difficulty (my difficulty, at least), is not in
distinguishing between a French "r" and "x", but between French "r"
and "xr". Given any "r" other than the French, I can distinguish.
But I have studied French for many years and feel that I have decent
pronunciation, but I cannot myself figure out how to pronounce the
French "r" differently from "xr". If such a difference exists, I
doubt I could pick it out in a full-speed speech stream, but I should
like to hear a recording out of curiosity.

With any other "r" that I know (and I'm not a linguist), including
American ("aveolar"?) and various degrees of trilled, I can fairly
easily produce and recognize the distinction. I personally use a
trilled "r" in my Lojban, because I think it is more distinct than my
native American "r", and it also discourages me from falling into the
other American habit of slopping up my vowels.

mu'omi'e randl.