From jjllambias@hotmail.com Tue Feb 12 08:58:40 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: jjllambias@hotmail.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_2); 12 Feb 2002 16:58:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 42282 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2002 16:58:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (216.115.97.171) by m12.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Feb 2002 16:58:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO hotmail.com) (216.33.241.153) by mta3.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Feb 2002 16:58:39 -0000 Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 08:58:38 -0800 Received: from 200.69.6.21 by lw8fd.law8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 16:58:38 GMT To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Bcc: Subject: Re: [lojban] tautologies Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 16:58:38 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2002 16:58:38.0980 (UTC) FILETIME=[847E3C40:01C1B3E6] From: "Jorge Llambias" X-Originating-IP: [200.69.6.21] X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=6071566 X-Yahoo-Profile: jjllambias2000 la rab cusku di'e >Since Spanish was brought up, how about we look at it for an example? >Based on my knowledge of Spanish (three years of state-mandated crap and >two of actually learning it) the way they express that kind of statement >is by explicitly making a tautology: > >"Cueste lo que cueste, yo lo compro." > >Which means something like "It costs what it costs, I buy it." I'll >defer to Jorge if he wants to clarify. The Spanish is quite correct. The English is lacking the subjunctive. Maybe: "Cost it what it may cost, I buy it". >This seems to be the kind of thing that would translate well to Lojban. Doing subjunctive in Lojban is even harder than in English. English at least has a remnant of one. >Could it be something like {ko'a noi leke'a jdima cu jdima ke'a zo'u >vecnu ri mi}? I would do that in Spanish as: "Eso, que cuesta lo que cuesta, lo compro." "That thing, which costs what it costs, I buy it." No subjunctive and therefore no suggestion as to what would happen if it didn't cost what it costs. mu'o mi'e xorxes _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com