From arosta@uclan.ac.uk Wed Feb 13 07:03:47 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: arosta@uclan.ac.uk X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_2); 13 Feb 2002 15:03:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 23047 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2002 15:03:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (216.115.97.167) by m9.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 13 Feb 2002 15:03:46 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO com1.uclan.ac.uk) (193.61.255.3) by mta1.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 13 Feb 2002 15:03:45 -0000 Received: from gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk by com1.uclan.ac.uk with SMTP (Mailer); Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:37:27 +0000 Received: from DI1-Message_Server by gwise-gw1.uclan.ac.uk with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:03:40 +0000 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 5.5.2 Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:03:20 +0000 To: lojban Subject: Re: [lojban] tautologies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline From: And Rosta X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=810630 X-Yahoo-Profile: andjamin pierre: #On Wednesday 13 February 2002 08:49, And Rosta wrote: #> I would point out, though, that at times you will be forced to use #> xi subscripting: #> #> "What is it such that whoever Jane believes took it, you will #> still report a crime to the police?" #> #> i pau xi pa kau xi re ge Jane believes ma xi re took ma xi pa, #> gi you will still report a crime to the police # #Does {xipa} modify {pau} or {i} here? pau. If that's not grammatical, then xi subscripting won't fix what would otherwise be a problem. #> Also, how would you distinguish between #> #> Jane knows who went #> #> and #> #> Jane knows that whoever went, she will still go herself # #.i la djein. djuno ledu'u makau klama #.i la djein. djuno ledu'u segu makau klama gi ba'e vo'a ba klama # #{kau} in the RHS of {.iju} (or the LHS of {segu}, as here, which is=20 #equivalent) indicates q-ever. (BTW, I asked that question meaning "how would yous say these using Jorge's new construction?".) Does it? Let me think. No, I don't think it does. It means=20 "Jane knows which x is such that she will go whether-or-not x went." -- I really think that Jorge's construction won't fly, but if anyone can get it to work, it's him. --And.